Who is the LONG ISLAND SERIAL KILLER? *ARREST JULY 2023*

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Who is the Long Island serial killer? This is a general discussion thread about this terrifying case.


MEMBER'S ONLY DISCUSSION/DOCUMENTS:
https://www.crimewatchers.net/threa...other-sensitive-information.3498/#post-226869
 
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You and I certainly don't always agree but I agree with you on this one. I don't think you'd argue we don't always agree lol.
I can argue about most anything but I agree we don't always agree.

It is really interesting going over these older articles. This one is only from July this year just after CB's arrest. It is a good recap of previous discoveries and searches.

The first four sets of remains were just random finds then the next find started with a K9 'training exercise' that eventually found several more sets of remains followed by Shannon's remains about a year later.

 
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SHANNAN'S CLOTHES​

Former Suffolk Police Commissioner Richard Dormer claimed to a reporter that Shannan ran through the bramble, which pulled her jeans off, according to Ray.
I think it surely must be from Commissioner Dormer that I got the info about her jeans having been among the other discarded items because I can't think of any other source I'd have trusted enough to believe.
 
Sources and proof? And how was she doing that night prior to going and generally?

Also what is the john's mental health and drug use?

Tell me more about the sick john please? And explain the driver/pimp? All about Shannon.

Was she chronic with cocaine? Did she not function mentally in life? Where does it all come from? WHAT had she done that night and what was her state of mind that day?
Apparently the pimp drove off once Shannon called the police.

So reviewing the victims, first one was Karen in Feb 1996 and last one was Amber in Sept 2010 is that right?

10 victims in all and CB has been charged so far with 3, Melissa July 2009, Megan June 2010, Amber Sept 2010 plus a possible 4th, Maureen July 2007.

So that leaves seven victims remaining, 3 unidentified at present.

Karen missing Feb 14th 1996
"Peaches" discovered in 1997
Baby "Peaches" discovered April 2011
Asian male discovered April 2011
Valerie missing Spring/Summer 2000
Jessica missing July 21st 2003
Shannon missing in May 2010

So the killer has been operating since at least 1996 (Karen Vergata) and the last one appears to be Amber Costello in Sept 2010. Of note is the fact that 3 victims were killed in 2010 and they appear to be the last victims - 13 years ago. So what happened 13 years ago, for him to stop, I wonder? ..... the Shannon Gilbert episode resulting in all the searches and subsequent discoveries of the bodies. So no more killings after that. He got scared of being caught, I think.
 
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No cocaine or drugs of abuse were found in her body based on the private autopsy Regina posted. Her sister ended up with mental problems and perhaps that's why she freaked out and ran off but it does not explain how she died from apparent strangulation and not drowning as the police reported.
Yeah this was no drowning. Give me a break that they think they can sell that.

I am admtting I don't have time to read your links, I am taking time I don't have even to be on here. Won't go into why or the day etc. as that takes MORE time I don't have.

I hear in Shannon as many do something entirely different than I guess cops and some do. Male cops especially. if no female has ever been in total fear either in life they wouldn't hear it. She COULD be under the inluence of a drug or alcohol or NOT but even if she is the instinct comes through.

I AGREE.
 
Just found these - Tina Foglia fits the profile of "petite sex worker" police have entered her into NAMUS apparently.

Tina Foglia


There are others too -

Judith Ramona Veloz



This article is a good recap of the whole case and mentions three new possible victims.



"Still, this case is by no means open and shut. There will be more prosecutions to follow, and more questions to answer. One of the big ones: Are there more victims? Among the list of other potential LISK victims are Tina Foglia, whose dismembered remains were found in Gilgo Beach in 1986; Judith Ramona Veloz, who went missing from New York City in 1993; and Natasha Jugo, whose car was found abandoned in Gilgo Beach in 2013."
 
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(You're welcome.)
I was curious as to what info you'd find remarkable...
What I find remarkable is 1) Shannon wasn't last seen running from Brewer's house as stated in Baden's report, she was "last seen" running from his neighbor's house. (Colletti). Her last known location at yet another neighbor's house, which may be- not sure- is nearest to where her personal items- including her phone, if I'm not mistaken- were found.
2) Surgery to her jaw- which had a metal plate- wasn't mentioned or reported by Baden as present or missing.
3) The report seems to imply that since no drugs were found, that none were ever there to have been found, which is simply not true.
4) Baden states that info is insufficient to determine cause of death, which means that his opinion is actually undetermined.
(Manner should be determined based on circumstances surrounding the death.)
Why would surgery to her jaw need to be mentioned? I fail to grasp a bit of signiifcance there? But I could be missing something so enlighten me?

You aren't sure where her personal items were found and in and of itself that is signifciant. The last thing i think I recall, IF EVEN TRUE, she was at some woman's door who called cops but was not going to let anyone in...

Your comment about drugs is easily vice versa, how can you say there WERE any? They before Baden found none.

Finally her death is undetermined and that is where it should be because of all these questions that you nor they can answer in even a close to conclusive manner.
 
Yeah this was no drowning. Give me a break that they think they can sell that.

I am admtting I don't have time to read your links, I am taking time I don't have even to be on here. Won't go into why or the day etc. as that takes MORE time I don't have.

I hear in Shannon as many do something entirely different than I guess cops and some do. Male cops especially. if no female has ever been in total fear either in life they wouldn't hear it. She COULD be under the inluence of a drug or alcohol or NOT but even if she is the instinct comes through.

I AGREE.
That's ok if you don't have time to read the whole of the links. Some are very long so that's why I usually copy pasta the important bits.
 
Why would surgery to her jaw need to be mentioned? I fail to grasp a bit of signiifcance there? But I could be missing something so enlighten me?

You aren't sure where her personal items were found and in and of itself that is signifciant. The last thing i think I recall, IF EVEN TRUE, she was at some woman's door who called cops but was not going to let anyone in...

Your comment about drugs is easily vice versa, how can you say there WERE any? They before Baden found none.

Finally her death is undetermined and that is where it should be because of all these questions that you nor they can answer in even a close to conclusive manner.
I'll jump in and answer 'cos I think I know. She had a car accident and I think she had her jaw fixed with metal. They were searching with a metal detector at some point I read somewhere.

ETA I corrected this in post 1134 below.
 
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This is an article from July this year. I don't think it has been posted before. Some interesting snippets.


John Ray, the family lawyer of Shannan has maintained that her death was not caused by a drug-induced drowning, as has been previously reported by CBS as the department's stance, but rather by a killer that has yet to be identified.
"When the police claimed that she had wandered into the marsh and managed to kill herself, when I had seen the autopsy report where she's found face up laying on a bush, and the police had claimed she drowned. That didn't make any sense," Ray exclusively told The U.S.

RULED A HOMICIDE​

Shannan's cause of death in her initial autopsy was undetermined, but Shannan's family decided to get a second opinion.
The second autopsy found that Shannan "met a violent end, that she was strangled," Ray said in a previous interview.
Ray was there when world-renowned medical examiner Dr. Michael Baden performed the second autopsy.
"When we looked at the bones, we were able to discern that the very small, significant hyoid bone in the neck, was cracked on one edge," Ray said.
Baden's autopsy "indicated that she did not die of natural causes and it was consistent with homicide," Ray said.
Ray also pointed out that there was a hole at the base of Shannan's hyoid bone that was found in the second autopsy.
"It appears be to something was either drilled or pushed through that bone.
"And we couldn't determine what that was, but it was highly unusual," the lawyer said.
While Ray maintains that Shannan died by homicide, he said it is unclear who murdered Shannan and has never claimed that Heuermann was behind the alleged crime.

INVESTIGATING THE MARSH​

Ray said he was concerned by the police's drowning explanation and what he called a "fallback position" where local authorities also claimed she could have died from natural elements after she got lost in the marsh.
"So I said, 'You know what? The best way to learn about this is go there yourself and see what this terrible marsh was like, such that it would've killed her,'" the lawyer said.
Ray, a Long Island native who spent summers at the beach and has experience as a lifeguard, said he thought it was odd that Shannan could have gotten lost in a local marsh.
"I don't believe Shannon ever entered the marsh," Ray said.
Ray went into the marsh to investigate on the same day Shannan disappeared a year before with the conditions and weather being similar.
He began searching the marsh at 4.53am on May 1, 2012, as that was the time Shannan first made her hysteric 911 call.
Ray entered the marsh at the same location, he called it a "quasi opening," where local police said she entered.
"You have to work at it, but you can get in," he said.
It may have been hard to get into the marsh, according to Ray, but he said it was not difficult to get out.
"Either side of the marsh there were escape routes easily found," the lawyer said. "It would be absurd to say somebody got lost in the marsh and died because they couldn't get out."
Ray explained that when walking in the marsh "the loam you walked on was damp and sometimes had a little water that would come up over say the tip of your boot. And that was about it. It wasn't deep at all."
He added: "Even if she fell into the canals, they weren't deep. They're like not even waist deep — they'd come up to your thighs for an average person."
Shannan was seen running out of a client, Joseph Brewer's, house on the day she vanished, rushing to neighbors' houses for help.
Two neighbors called 911, one of them being Barbara Brennan.
Brennan called around 5.30am that day, Ray explained, saying that it was only a few minutes before dawn.
"So twilight would've been the condition, not pitch darkness," Ray said. "So the police theory that she got lost in the dark and got confused is absurd."
"In fact, as we went through the marsh, as we progressed, we could see our way into the homes that lined from Oak Beach — that lined the marsh on the south side of it," Ray added.

SHANNAN'S CLOTHES​

Former Suffolk Police Commissioner Richard Dormer claimed to a reporter that Shannan ran through the bramble, which pulled her jeans off, according to Ray.
"First of all, any girl who wears jeans they're not baggies like in the hippie days — they're tight jeans and they don't come off because sticker bushes pull them as you go through the marsh," Ray said.
Ray added: "How do you get them off? You have to take them off, or somebody's gotta take them off for you."
"So then they argue, well she panicked and in her panic because she was on drugs, she was hallucinating and she got wet and she took off her pants," Ray said.
"That's absurd as well," he said, noting that there is "zero evidence" that she was on drugs the day she vanished.
Ray said in a previous interview that Shannan was wearing a bra in photographs taken of her body and that the band that attaches the two bra cups was cut in half.
"It wasn't torn like an animal would do it," the lawyer said.

READ MORE ON THE US SUN​

As questions about Shannan's death continue to go unanswered, the public has been also wondering about the several other remains that were found along Ocean Parkway in 2011.
The Suffolk County Police Department told The U.S. Sun that it has not made any comments regarding statements made by John Ray.
The public has been also wondering about the several other remains that were found along Ocean Parkway in 2011
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The public has been also wondering about the several other remains that were found along Ocean Parkway in 2011
The bramble pulled her jeans off... Possible I guess... But talk about fitting thoughts to what LE wants to be the answer or whatever... No checking or testing I am guessing....
 
The bramble pulled her jeans off... Possible I guess... But talk about fitting thoughts to what LE wants to be the answer or whatever... No checking or testing I am guessing....

There is no way bramble pulls her jeans off. Especially because her jeans were probably tight. She was a prostitute.
 
NO, she was identified just in August of THIS year. RECENTLY in other words.
She was identified last year but they held it back due to the Investigation. I posted this the other day.

Mr Tierney told reporters that Vergata had been positively identified via DNA in August 2022 but investigators kept the development under wraps due to the ongoing investigation into Mr Heuermann. Officials refused to comment on whether or not her murder may be linked to the suspected serial killer.
The district attorney also attributed the delay to the need to contact Vergata’s family members.
However, it has since emerged that Vergata’s two biological sons - Eric and Gary Doherty - apparently were not informed before Friday’s announcement."
 
Just to correct my post about Shannan's jaw and the metal plate. It wasn't a car accident, her jaw was broken by a boyfriend. This article is from 2011.


The search for Gilbert’s body intensified a week ago after her purse, I.D. and cell phone, as well as her jeans, shoes and various other articles of her clothing were found in the thick, undergrowth that stretches along the length of the barrier island, not far from Oak Beach. It took dozens of machete-wielding police officers, a bulldozer and an amphibious vehicle to find and recover the remains.

Continued at link




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Apparently the pimp drove off once Shannon called the police.
I don't think that's an accurate characterization because he was still trying to get her to get in the vehicle when she ran away from Gus Coletti's.

So reviewing the victims, first one was Karen in Feb 1996 and last one was Amber in Sept 2010 is that right?
Based on what's determined at this point, yes.
However, if I'm not mistaken, the remains of the Asian male are believed to be as early as '96 but of course, that's only an estimate. Also, re the remains of the mother and her toddler, I don't recall how old those were estimated to be.
 
Why would surgery to her jaw need to be mentioned? I fail to grasp a bit of signiifcance there? But I could be missing something so enlighten me?
I was pointing out the fact that Baden's report contained inaccurate and/or incomplete information.
Your comment about drugs is easily vice versa, how can you say there WERE any?
I'm not. I'm saying that if there were, tox wouldn't show it.
But it's a fact of her victimology that she was known to use cocaine, which is helpful info to be aware of to possibly explain her behaviors. Having said that, I don't think the cause of her behaviors could be determined conclusively, only surmised.
Finally her death is undetermined and that is where it should be because of all these questions that you nor they can answer in even a close to conclusive manner.
No, I don't know all the answers but still, I do think there's enough info to conclude manner.
 
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In the video below, circumstances surrounding Shannon's disappearance are discussed early during the first part and then there's a little more discussion near the last.
 
I cannot emphasize as much that this may be the BIGGEST MUCH WATCH I have ever recommended. I am entirely wiped out from my day and have not even caught up with one thread (Delphi) but was listening to this while doing that and quit and watched this. I am heading for bed, e lucky if I get three hours sleep as early work shift tomorrow, I have a lot to say and discuss about it if I get time, but you all definitely should, I don't care what you think of John RAy, this is a MUST WATCH.

 
I don't think that's an accurate characterization because he was still trying to get her to get in the vehicle when she ran away from Gus Coletti's.


Based on what's determined at this point, yes.
However, if I'm not mistaken, the remains of the Asian male are believed to be as early as '96 but of course, that's only an estimate. Also, re the remains of the mother and her toddler, I don't recall how old those were estimated to be.

Must be pre '97 for mother and toddler. Asian Male was not discovered till 2011. From my post above -

Peaches" discovered in 1997
Baby "Peaches" discovered April 2011
Asian male discovered April 2011

So if it was CB he was active in '97.
 
Apparently the pimp drove off once Shannon called the police.

So reviewing the victims, first one was Karen in Feb 1996 and last one was Amber in Sept 2010 is that right?

10 victims in all and CB has been charged so far with 3, Melissa July 2009, Megan June 2010, Amber Sept 2010 plus a possible 4th, Maureen July 2007.

So that leaves seven victims remaining, 3 unidentified at present.

Karen missing Feb 14th 1996
"Peaches" discovered in 1997
Baby "Peaches" discovered April 2011
Asian male discovered April 2011
Valerie missing Spring/Summer 2000
Jessica missing July 21st 2003
Shannon missing in May 2010

So the killer has been operating since at least 1996 (Karen Vergata) and the last one appears to be Amber Costello in Sept 2010. Of note is the fact that 3 victims were killed in 2010 and they appear to be the last victims - 13 years ago. So what happened 13 years ago, for him to stop, I wonder? ..... the Shannon Gilbert episode resulting in all the searches and subsequent discoveries of the bodies. So no more killings after that. He got scared of being caught, I think.
I look at it as what got him to stop in that area. This man had so many "homes" that he may well have just gone where the heat wasn't so heavy to satisfy his sick urges OR even found a new dumping ground in NYC/way of disposal there or away from there somewhat. There isn't much that would surprise me re him.

So IF the killer of the first and last at least, he was operating from the age of APPROXIMATELY 33 to 47. He is my age or close so I am just ballparking from that. Hoewver, it is pretty clear from LE that he was up to worrisome activity yet again which was one reason for closing the net when they did. And now of course hie is 59 or 60....We have heard the stats on ages and when tehy quit and such but I don't go with generalties full on. This man, CB, is also becoming or starting to appear to be someone with quite the rage in him.

If you get a chance listen to the video with John Ray I posted last night. I know you don't do videos but this one is worth it imo and truly a must watch.

Another thing I should add before I am out of time this EARLY morn and early work hours is they mentioned in that that Asa's attorney recently came out and said something too a few days ago. I was going to mention that but by time I finished Ray's talk, it seemed unimportant almost. I didn't go find it or have time and was going down for the count. But to have this thread current, if anyone has time, it should probably be linked.

And for anyone who thinks John Ray is some buffoon, listen to him through this because he knows his stuff. There are also several new nuggets and good info in it. I do think he very well may have polygraphed these witnesses.
 

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