Monday 6th - morning update
WARNING - GRAPHIC TESTIMONY
LIVE UPDATES FROM THE CHAD DAYBELL TRIAL
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Please excuse the typos. These are live updates from the courtroom.
11:59 a.m. Chad repeatedly stresses that Melani needs to get out of Rexburg. Blake says this would be a good stopping point for lunch. Be back in one hour.
11:58 a.m. Lori tells Melani she needs to get out of Rexburg so the police aren’t targeting her. Chad suggests going to Idaho Falls and they can find a house for the same price. Melani says, “We’ll go wherever. I’ll live in a dumpster with Ian. He’s so amazing.” Chad says Idaho Falls has good prices for rentals.
11:56 a.m. Melani asks about Rexburg being a place of safety. Chad says yes but there will be dark times and people starving by McDonald’s. Lori says they were all told to go to Rexburg but because of the “agency of the dark,” Satan has infiltrated people including the police who are very dark.
11:54 a.m. Chad suggests they need to permanently move from Rexburg – not just get an Airbnb in Idaho Falls. Melani asks how to get Hermosillo to stop. “He’s just raged with this whole thing. He was yelling at me and said he wasn’t going to stop.” Chad says Hermosillo isn’t going anywhere and Melani needs to leave. “The wicked stay in one place and the righteous leave.” Chad tells Melani she needs to leave like Lehi had to leave Jerusalem. Chad tells Melani to get on Zillow and look for housing.
11:52 a.m. Another portion of the recording is played. Chad says “they’re not going to leave you alone. The network is pretty deep and they’re going to see you as the target.” Chad says for Melani’s sake and sanity she should leave. Chad says Melani was led to Rexburg to find Ian but now it’s time for her to move away. Melani says Ian’s kids are there. Chad says Madison County is a cursed place.
11:51 a.m. Blake plays another part of the recording. Melani is talking with Chad and Lori. Chad said he was worried law enforcement were still watching Melani. Ian had already spoken with police and knew they were looking for JJ and Tylee.
11:49 a.m. Blake asks Ian what Gibb lied about. Ian says she lied about having JJ in her possession. On the recording, there was a reference to Dave being the problem. Dave is David Warwick, Gibb’s boyfriend at the time.
11:47 a.m. Blake plays another part of the recording. Melani says she hasn’t trusted Gibb and Lori says she can no longer be trusted because she called the police. “I don’t see it going anywhere bad for any of us,” Lori says on the call.
11:45 a.m. Another portion of the recording is played. Melani talks about Lt. Ball bringing her banana bread and she was worried he might be poisoning her. Lori says he’s probably good but Hope and Hermosillo are the bad ones.
11:43 a.m. Blake plays another portion of the call. We hear Melani talking about emotional attacks. Ian says there were not physical attacks but spiritual attacks from Satan. Ian had not heard of these types of attacks before he met Melani.
11:38 a.m. During the first portion, Ian says we hear Alex and Zulema talking about Dave “not buying anything.” Ian says Gibb and David were going to step away because things were getting hot. A female says Raphael – referencing Chad. Lori and Chad then join the call and Melani is sobbing. Ian says Melani was relieved to hear their voice. Chad and Lori would call in and then disappear for days or a week at a time. Ian did not know where Chad and Lori were during this time.
11:37 a.m. Blake says there are 87 minutes of recordings but we will only hear portions today.
11:36 a.m. These recordings have never been played publicly before today.
11:34 a.m. Blake moves to admit the secret recordings Ian made while on his honeymoon with Melani in Jackson Hole.
11:33 a.m. Ian had an apartment across the street from Melani’s in Rexburg in December 2019. When they got married, he moved into Melani’s apartment. Chad told Ian that he and Melani should leave as soon as possible to get away from law enforcement.
11:31 a.m. Ian went to law enforcement on Dec. 4 or 5, 2019. They asked if he would record conversations for them. He said he would. Chad and Lori told Ian that specific detectives were possessed. Ian recorded the conversations on Dec. 6-7-8. There was later a call with Lori and Chad where Ian learned Alex had died.
11:30 a.m. Melani shared things the night of their marriage that caused him concerns. The next morning, Ian’s daughter thought it would be funny to play hide-and-seek. His daughter would not answer him for five minutes and it was quiet. He eventually found her. He was concerned for JJ and Tylee and also concerned for his two children and his ex-wife.
11:28 a.m. Ian never met JJ or Tylee. During the Zoom call, Ian was at his sister’s home in Arizona. He did not know where Chad and Lori were. Ian told Melani the blessing was odd. Melani shared some of her religious beliefs with him prior to their marriage but the bulk of it was the night they got married. Ian was originally open to some of the idea but on their wedding night, things changed.
11:26 a.m. Ian met with Chad and Lori on Zoom to ask for their blessing in marrying Melani. Melani looked to them as parents. Ian asked for their blessing and they approved of her marrying Melani. Chad and Lori also gave Ian a religious blessing. “They talked about shielding me with light, removing dark weapons from me,” Ian says. The blessing was on Zoom and not in-person. He says it was very unorthodox.
11:25 a.m. Blake is questioning Ian. She asks how Ian knows Lori, Alex and Chad. Ian met Lori and Chad on Nov. 23 or 24, 2019. They met in person in Lori’s Rexburg apartment. Ian met Alex Cox the night Ian and Melani got married – Nov. 30, 2019.
11:23 a.m. I interviewed Ian and Melani in 2020 before the children were found. You can find part of the interview
here.
11:22 a.m. Next witness is Ian Pawlowski – Melani’s husband.
11:20 a.m. Sidebar is over. Blake asks about the light and dark. Melani asked Lori to get the answers from Chad. Blake asks if she learned if Charles was designated as dark. He was. Blake asks if JJ and Tylee were designated as dark. They were. None of them are still alive. Blake has no further questions.
11:18 a.m. Prior asks for a sidebar. White noise is played in the courtroom.
11:17 a.m. Blake asks if Melani has ever heard teachings about zombies in the LDS faith. Melani says no. Blake asks if Lori and Chad lived together in Arizona. Melani says they had separate apartments.
11:16 a.m. Melani says Chad and Lori would use the scriptures as a basis and then elaborate their as far as light and dark, etc.
11:15 a.m. Prior has nothing further. Blake will now conduct re-direct. She asks if Chad and Lori taught her these things. “I believe the ideas were from both of them.”
11:14 a.m. Prior asks if there was anything unusual with the relationship of Alex and Lori. Melani says not that she observed. Prior asks if Alex lived with Lori in Arizona. Melani says for a time. Melani doesn’t know if Alex wanted to go to Hawaii when Lori moved. Alex did move with Lori to Rexburg.
11:12 a.m. Prior asks about zombies and if all the information she learned about zombies came from Lori. Melani says she assumes it came from Chad. She can’t remember if Chad used the term zombie in front of her.
11:11 a.m. Melani says Gibb told her that she went to camps to teach people about energy work.
11:10 a.m. Prior asks Melani if she participated in energy work with Gibb or Lori. Melani says she listened to the ideas.
11:08 a.m. Prior asks Melani what energy work means. Melani says she isn’t too familiar on it but people who do energy work do something similar to a reading – certain connections to ancestors. He asks about vibrations. Melani says in energy work, you can be on a higher or lower vibration or frequency.
11:07 a.m. Prior asks Melani about Julie Rowe. Melani says she has never met Rowe but believes she had podcasts that spoke about spiritual beliefs. Melani never participated in Gibb’s podcasts. Prior asks about castings and if it was part of her LDS faith. Melani says it talks about castings in the scriptures but she wasn’t familiar with it.
11:06 a.m. Prior asks about light and dark being in the LDS faith. “It does talk about light and dark in the scriptures,” Melani says. Prior asks Melani if she ever spoke directly to Chad about Tylee and JJ. Melani doesn’t know if she did.
11:04 a.m. Prior asks if the vast majority of information Melani received about Chad came from Lori. Melani says that’s correct. Prior asks about Lori moving to Idaho and if Melani was aware Lori had talked about moving in with Melanie Gibb. Melani is not aware of that information.
11:03 a.m. Melani says some of the ideas at the conference were LDS based. Prior asks if the conferences were inconsistent with the LDS Church. Melani says not that she saw. Prior asks about Seven Gatherers. Melani says it doesn’t ring a bell and she was never part of a group called the Seven Gatherers.
11:02 a.m. Prior asks Melani to explain Preparing a People. She says she didn’t know much about it but Chad was speaking and there was mostly LDS-based ideas about the Second Coming – how to prepare for the end of times.
11 a.m. Melani was living in Gilbert, Arizona in 2018. She lived about 10-12 minutes from Lori. Prior asks Melani about Melanie Gibb. They met toward the end of 2018. Melani attended a Preparing a People event in 2018 where Chad spoke.
10:59 a.m. Prior asks about Lori going to Hawaii in Nov. 2019. Melani says Lori went for 7-10 days. Prior asks if Melani recalls Lori leaving for a longer period of time during 2019-2020 to Hawaii. Melani isn’t sure how long Lori went.
10:58 a.m. Blake has no further questions. Prior will now cross-examine.
10:57 a.m. When police were looking for the children, Melani says Alex seemed calm and normal. Melani says Chad reached out to her and said Brandon was following her and put a tracking device on her car. That turned out to be true and Melani says it validated a lot of what Chad was saying.
10:55 a.m. Melani says Lori and Alex had a playful, fun sibling relationship and would help each other out. Alex would help Lori if she needed his help. Alex admired Chad and looked up to him like a brother, Melani says. “I believe Alex had enough trust in Chad that he would listen to him,” Melani says.
10:53 a.m. Melani says Chad and Lori told her Rexburg Det. Ray Hermosillo and Rexburg Det. Dave Hope were dark. Melani moved to Rexburg the first week of Nov. 2019. She was also living there in Dec. 2019. After the kids were declared missing, Chad told Melani that Madison County was not safe and that she needed to move away.
10:52 a.m. Blake asks where the idea of the body having to die if it became too dark came from. Melani says she believes it came from Chad. Chad and Lori told Melani that law enforcement was corrupt and after them. They said police could not be trusted and told Melani not to speak with law enforcement.
10:51 a.m. Melani says she was taught there was some type of darkness that could not be cast out and the Lord would take the person because the darkness was too much.
10:50 a.m. Blake asks about The Church of the Firstborn. Melani says Chad was meant to be a leader in the church and Chad and Lori were supposed to help with the Second Coming of Jesus Christ. Melani would ask Chad if someone was dark or light. She eventually learned a different term for people who were possessed: zombie. Lori introduced the term to her.
10:48 a.m. Melani says Lori gave her messages from Chad. Blake asks if something happened in Idaho while Melani was in Hawaii. Melani says yes – Tammy Daybell passed away. Melani says Lori seemed to be in a state of shock. Lori went back to Idaho. Melani stayed in Hawaii. Alex was supposed to go with them on the trip to Hawaii but Chad had something he needed help with.
10:46 a.m. Melani says Lori was never on the phone with JJ or Tylee. When they went to Hawaii, JJ and Tylee were not there. Melani heard Lori on the phone but Lori used headphones so Melani never knew who Lori was talking to. Melani says she thought she knew the nature of Chad and Lori’s relationship but now she has different ideas.
10:45 a.m. When Melani asked about JJ, Lori said she had hired a nanny who was taking care of JJ. Melani doesn’t remember seeing Chad during her visit. In October, Melani went with Lori to Hawaii. Before the Hawaii trip, they went to Missouri. Tylee and JJ were not with them. Melani asked Lori where they were. Lori said the nanny was helping with JJ and Tylee didn’t need a babysitter – she was being independent. Melani says Tylee could have also been helping with JJ.
10:43 a.m. Melani visited Lori in Rexburg at the end of September 2019 and stayed at her aunt’s apartment. JJ and Tylee were not there. Melani Gibb and David Warwick were not there. Melani asked Lori where Tylee was. Melani says she got a few different answers but one she recalls was Tylee was with a friend doing her own thing at college.
10:42 a.m. Blake asks Melani if she ever asked Lori why she was moving to Rexburg. Melani says Lori was telling everyone different things and needed to be protected. Lori said she was going into hiding. Lori took Tylee and JJ to Rexburg. Alex helped them move and also moved himself.
10:41 a.m. Blake asks Melani if she ever spoke to Alex about Charles’ death. She said Alex told her Charles became angry, they got into a fight, a baseball bat was involved and then Alex ended up shooting Charles.
10:39 a.m. Melani learned about the death of Charles from Adam Cox, her uncle. Adam says Charles had been murdered. Melani remembers going to see Lori. Lori and Tylee explained Alex got into a fight with Charles and Alex shot Charles.
10:38 a.m. Blake asks Melani if she knows Tylee. Melani says yes – Tylee is her cousin. The last time she saw Tylee is when Tylee was packing her items preparing to move from Arizona to Idaho. JJ was also Melani’s cousin.
10:38 a.m. Blake asks Melani if she knows where the idea of castings originated. “From what I remember, their teachings and ideas were constantly changing but I believe the original idea came from the Julie Rowe podcast where she would teach how to cast out,” Melani says. Melani says Chad and Lori then added their own ideas to it.
10:36 a.m. Melani learned at some point that JJ was affected by some type of darkness. She also learned that Chad labeled Tylee as dark. Melani assumes Chad labeled JJ as dark.
10:35 a.m. Melani recalls being invited by Lori to do a casting on Charles Vallow. Melani says Lori and Chad believed Charles was affected by a dark spirit. Charles was not physically present and nothing physically was being done to Charles.
10:33 a.m. From what Melani was told, Chad didn’t always need his pendulum but it was something extra he could use. Melani recalls learning about casting – you raise your right hand and cast out a dark spirit or demon. Chad and Lori explained how to cast spirits out.
10:32 a.m. Melani says the idea about light and dark came from Chad. Melani says Chad said he had a gift to spiritually discern and he could see light and dark and if a person had good intentions. Melani recalls Chad used a necklace/pendant/pendulum that he would use to get answers. Melani makes a swinging motion with her hand.
10:30 a.m. Melani says she was close with Lori. She met Chad in 2018. Melani would send messages to Chad through Lori asking for guidance and advice. Melani says she developed a close relationship with Chad and began referring to him as dad. Melani recalls Chad and Lori sharing with her teachings about light and dark.
10:28 a.m. Melani has dark hair and white-rimmed glasses. She walks into the courtroom with her two attorneys – Garrett Smith and Joshua Garner.
10:27 a.m. Next witness is Melani Pawlowski – Lori Vallow’s niece.
10:23 a.m. Blake asks Boyce if they can approach before calling the next witness. Attorneys huddle in corner as white noise is played in the courtroom.
10:21 a.m. We are back in the courtroom. Boyce is on the bench and jurors are being brought in.
9:53 a.m. Boyce suggests we take a mid-morning recess. Back in 20-30 minutes.
9:51 a.m. Wood asks about himself being at the planning meeting and asks Daniels if he recalls the two Fremont prosecutors being at the meeting. Daniels doesn’t remember as he didn’t really know people. Daniels says dog and cat remains were also found at the property. Wood has no further questions. Daniels will remain under subpoena.
9:50 a.m. Daniels talks about the cell phone ping that got officers to the general quadrant of the property but depressions in the ground and other factors helped lead them to the actual burial sites.
9:49 a.m. Wood follows up by asking about the tools that were collected. Daniels says they were packaged and given to the Rexburg Police Department.
9:48 a.m. Prior has no further questions. Wood will now have questions on re-direct.
9:47 a.m. Prior asks about a sign on the property. Daniels describes two wooden posts and a dog statue. Prior asks if that’s how they knew this was the area of the pet cemetery. Daniels says the dog statue and several depressions in the ground made him think this was the pet cemetery.
9:44 a.m. Prior asks a question, doesn’t like the answer and objects to the answer. Boyce then tells Prior to stop interrupting him as Prior interrupts the judge. Boyce tells Prior to stop interrupting people and to ask another question.
9:43 a.m. Prior asks if citizens or anyone else would have had access to Chad’s property on June 9-10. Daniels say no.
9:41 a.m. Prior asks about the shovels being moved and the photos being taken. Daniels say the tools were moved and photos were taken but he doesn’t know the exact timeframe. Prior asks if any law enforcement officers used Chad’s tools when they were digging on the property. Daniels says no, they did not.
9:40 a.m. Prior shows another photo of the shovels leaned up against a wall in the garage. He zooms in on the handle of the shovel and asks if he notices anything. Daniels say he’s still not seeing anything.
9:38 a.m. Prior shows another close-up photo of the shovel’s black handle. Prior asks if Daniels can see differences. “I don’t think I’m seeing what you want me to see,” Daniels says. “I see a black shovel handle.” Prior says, “Fair enough.”
9:36 a.m. Prior asks about the black handle on a shovel. He zooms in and asks Daniels what he sees on the handle. Daniels says it’s hard to tell what it is. “It’s something, right?” Prior asks. Daniels says he can’t tell what it is.
9:35 a.m. Prior shows the wide shot photo of the tools laid out on the ground of the garage. These are the tools that were seized. Prior asks Daniels if he laid out the tools. Daniels says no, someone else on scene did.
9:32 a.m. Prior zooms in a large black-handled took. He asks Daniels if there is anything that indicates there could be an issue with the tool. Daniels says he would need to look at the entire tool. “There’s more than just looking at a little speck on the handle.”
9:30 a.m. Prior shows a photo of the tools in Chad’s garage. He asks Daniels if all of the tools were confiscated. He says not all of them. Daniels walked by all of the tools and says the photo is an “as-is” picture of what things looked like that day.
9:27 a.m. Prior asks what plans wiere put in place to secure the property on the evening of June 9. Police stopped working around 5 p.m. Daniels says local law enforcement secured the scene that evening.
9:25 a.m. Prior asks about the backhoe. Daniels says the backhoe was utilized to excavate the area about Tylee’s remains. Prior asks if all of the remains of Tylee were removed from the gravesite. Daniels says yes. Prior asks if all of the remains of JJ were removed. Daniels says yes.
9:24 a.m. Prior asks about the theory of the prosecutors being the bodies were placed in the ground in Sept. 2019. Daniels says he doesn’t know what the theory is. Prior asks about the “necklace around Tylee’s neck.” Daniels says a charm was found at the site. It was observable by eye on the p of the ground.
9:23 a.m. Prior asks about the tree and irrigation pond near JJ’s burial site. He asks if the grass in the area looked like it had been moved. Daniels says not recently.
9:21 a.m. Prior asks Daniels if he recalls the door to the garage being open when police arrived. He doesn’t remember. Prior asks the distance from the back of the house to the place where JJ was found. Daniels doesn’t know the distance.
9:19 a.m. Prior asks Daniels if the large response would have drawn people to the scene to see what was going on. Daniels says maybe. Prior asks if Daniels looked around to see if people were watching what they were doing. Daniels says no, he was busy.
9:17 a.m. Daniels recalls there were just over 50 law enforcement officers on the scene over the two days. Prior asks if he’s aware Wood was there. Daniels recalls seeing him but didn’t know who Wood was at time.
9:16 a.m. Prior asks Daniels who was running the meeting. Daniels doesn’t remember. Prior asks who initiated the meeting. Daniels doesn’t know but guesses one of the case agents put it together.
9:14 a.m. Prior asks Daniels how many agencies were at the planning meeting before officers searched the property. Daniels doesn’t recall them all but says his team, other FBI employees, the Rexburg Police Department, Fremont County Sheriff’s Office and Rob Wood were all there.
9:13 a.m. Prior asks Daniels about his team staging at the Salem church and how many people were there. Daniels says eight on his team were there but he does not know a total amount of all law enforcement officers.
9:11 a.m. Prior asks about the structure attached to Chad Daybell’s garage. Prior asks Daniels if he has knowledge about what the second story is used for. He says on June 8, there was a mattress and comforter on the floor as if someone had been sleeping in the room. Prior asks Daniels if he knew who was residing in the residence in Sept. 2019 and June 2020. Daniels says he is not aware.
9:10 a.m. Prior asks if it’s unusual that Daniels can’t remember and needs to review his notes on the topic. Daniels says no – he didn’t know he was going to be asked about the apartment searches and has done a lot of searches.
9:09 a.m. Prior asks about Luminol being used on the scene. Daniels says that’s a tool used to determine if blood was involved. Prior asks if it was used in an upstairs apartment. Daniels says he doesn’t recall – he would need to review his notes.
9:07 a.m. Prior says he wants to go over the procedural aspects of Daniels’ involvement in the case. He begins by asking about the search of Alex Cox’s apartment. Daniels was an ERT Senior Team Leader in the search of two apartments in Rexburg – he doesn’t recall who was in which apartment. Prior asks about cadaver dogs being used in the search.
9:04 a.m. Wood has no further questions for Daniels. Prior will now cross-examine.
9:02 a.m. After the area was excavated, a backhoe was brought in to go deeper and wider just in case Tylee was buried in the same area. “It was logical to use that they might have put her in the same place,” Daniel says. Nothing else was found near JJ’s remains.
9 a.m. Daniels describes the next photo as showing more duct tape wrapped around the body. JJ’s remains were found first at the property and the first remains that were fully excavated and provided to the coroner on June 9, 2020.
8:58 a.m. The team continued to excavate and Daniels describes uncovering the feet area of the human remains. The black plastic wrapped the entire body. A big piece of duct tape started to appear on the wrapping as crews worked to uncover the remains.
8:57 a.m. Daniels describes the next photo as showing human hair coming out of the plastic. “That’s the point we knew these were human remains and those remains were JJ Vallow’s. This became JJ’s burial site.”
8:55 a.m. Daniels describes finding something wrapped in plastic. “It felt like it was a human head or skull inside that black plastic. You could tell that plastic was tied up with whatever was inside.” Daniels cut the black plastic and found white plastic wrapped around the skull.
8:54 a.m. The next photo shows two wooden planks that were under the stones. Boyce says because of the nature of the next pictures, they will not be shown to the public in the courtroom or on the livestream. Jurors will view the images on their monitors.
8:53 a.m. Daniels points out the stones were laid precisely in a row and you can see the tree roots around the rocks. Someone has taken the time to cut through the tree roots for the burial. Larry Woodcock is wiping tears from his eyes as Daniels testifies.
8:52 a.m. Prior objects and asks for a sidebar. Boyce grants the objection and attorneys huddle in the corner of the courtroom.
8:49 a.m. Daniels explains how the officers on scene removed the soil and vegetation layer by layer. Wood displays photos of the how the area looked after these layers are removed. We see a picture of the large stones that were lined up over wood that were on top of JJ’s wrapped body.
8:46 a.m. The next photos show a closer look at the burial site. There is higher grass around the spot and a thinning of vegetation in the area where JJ’s body was found along with a raised berm.
8:43 a.m. Wood begins by showing an overhead satellite photo of the tree and pond area where JJ Vallow’s body was found on Chad’s property.
8:41 a.m. Boyce is on the bench and the jurors have been seated. Lots of people in the gallery today. The spectators on the right side of the courtroom have been moved to the other side. It’s likely graphic photos will be shown.
8:32 a.m. The attorneys just left the courtroom and are meeting with Judge Steven Boyce.
8:30 a.m. Larry Woodcock is in the courtroom this morning. I asked if Kay was coming and he said, “Today is going to be a hard day. I told her it’s best if she stayed home.”
8:23 a.m. We are back in the courtroom for day 17 of Chad Daybell’s trial. Chad is dressed in a light colored dress shirt with a dark tie. He’s chatting with John Prior, his defense attorney. Madison Co. Prosecuting Attorney Rob Wood will continue questioning FBI Special Agent Steve Daniels – a member of Evidence Response Team (ERT).
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