LIBBY GERMAN & ABBY WILLIAMS: Indiana vs. Richard Allen for 2017 murder of two Delphi girls *GUILTY*

On February 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams and Liberty German were discovered near the Monon High Bridge Trail, which is part of the Delphi Historic Trails in Delphi, Indiana, United States, after the young girls had disappeared from the same trail the previous day. The murders have received significant media coverage because a photo and audio recording of an individual believed to be the girls' murderer was found on German's smartphone. Despite the audio and video recordings of the suspect that have been circulated and the more than 26,000 tips that police have received, no arrest in the case has been made.[1][2][3]



Police have not publicly stated nor released details of how the girls were murdered.[6] As early as February 15, 2017, Indiana State Police began circulating a still image of an individual reportedly seen on the Monon High Bridge Trail near where the two friends were slain; the grainy photograph appearing to capture a Caucasian male, with hands in pockets, walking on the rail bridge, head down, toward the girls.[4] A few days later, the person in the photograph was named the prime suspect in the double-homicide.[5]

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant,[7] though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." It was at this news conference that officials credited the source of the audio and imagery to German's smartphone, and, further, regarded her as a hero for having had the uncanny foresight and fortitude to record the exchange in secret. Police indicated that additional evidence from the phone had been secured, but that they did not release it so as not to "compromise any future trial." By this time, the reward offered in the case was set at $41,000.[5]

Murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On Feb 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams & Liberty German were discovered in Delphi, #INDIANA. The suspect in their deaths is awaiting trial.

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant, though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." Even with a lot of media coverage, their murders remain unsolved.

www.crimewatchers.net

 

[Cousin Dupree]

Kline wasted their time for 5 years. Finally they nailed Kline and then were able to arrest Allen. There is a link between Kline and Allen. Not sure exactly what it is yet (something to do with the Anthony Shots profile IMO).
Ron Logan drove himself to Lafayette but lied about it by saying someone drove him. However he was caught on camera driving himself to the dump that day. LE prosecuted and jailed him for that.

BTW Kline is appealing his sentence, I think I read. Will find link.

Kline appeal link

Kegan Kline appealing 40-year sentence in child pornography case

In March, Kline pleaded guilty to 25 charges, ranging from child exploitation and possession of child pornography to obstruction of justice.

www.wthr.com

Kline link explaining the run around and time wasting that he gave LE.

Police Say Delphi Murders Investigation Is ‘Extremely Complicated,’ ID Mysterious Catfish | Oxygen Official Site

Though investigators have publicly identified a man accused of creating a fake social media profile to commit child sex crimes, they’re keeping tight-lipped as to whether or not the alleged catfish has definitively been tied to the murder of two teen girls.

www.oxygen.com

That video won't play for me.

 

[Tresir]

That video won't play for me.

it's not a available to me either but just read the article instead, if you want.

I have another interesting link. A very recent interview with PW.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

it's not a available to me either but just read the article instead, if you want.

I have another interesting link. A very recent interview with PW.

Still watching. A couple of things so far:

Thanks, this is Firm 22:

Firm 22

Firm 22 is the name used by the Vinlanders Social Club, a racist skinhead group, to refer to supporters and associates of the group who are not actually members. The number 22 stands for the letter V.

www.adl.org

Also, the flag in the background is an original U.S. Flag. Racists often say they want the country to revert to its original form.

 

[Olenna]

parking th Court cameras link here; see Carroll County:

IN Court Streams - IN Court Streams

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

Court Orders - Judge says cameras allowed Thursday and onwards.
Orders below re: Cameras/Media, etc..

Order Issued The Court has received multiple requests for various legitimate media outlets to record the Court proceedings to be conducted on October 19, 2023, at 2:00 p.m. (These requests are filed in the case with this Order). Pursuant to the Code of Judicial Conduct, Rule 2.17, a judge shall prohibit broadcasting, televising, recording, or taking photographs in the Courtroom. However, a judge may authorize the broadcasting, televising, recording, digital streaming, or photographing of court proceedings or the Courtroom by members of the news media under certain conditions. (Rule 2.17(3)(a)(b)). News media is defined as persons employed by or representing a newspaper, periodical, press association, radio station, television station, or wire service and covered by I.C. 34-46-4-1. All of the submitted requests meet this definition. Counsel for the State and the defense have been provided with these requests, and both have previously submitted pleadings stating their positions on cameras in the Courtroom. (See defense Motion for Broadcasting Order, filed September 13, 2023, and State's Response to Defendant's Motion for Broadcasting Order, filed September 25, 2023). The Court has determined that allowing recording of the October 19, 2023, hearing is permitted provided that the means of recording will not distract the participants or impair the dignity of the proceedings, and the hearing itself is a non-confidential proceeding. The Court, therefore, authorizes the recording and broadcasting of the hearing set for October 19, 2023. The Court WILL NOT permit photographing or digital streaming of the proceedings. All news media will be required to wear/display identification and to wear appropriate attire. One or two cameras will be authorized for pool coverage of the hearing. Members of the general public are prohibited from broadcasting, recording, or photographing this proceeding. The Court will prohibit media broadcast during this hearing of attorney-client communications, bench conferences, and materials on counsel tables and the Court's bench. The Court has the sole discretion to interrupt or stop the coverage, or to limit or terminate the recording and broadcast by a news media organization at any time during the proceeding. The Court requests the media to become familiar with I.C. 34-46-4-1 and the Code of Judicial Conduct, Rule 2.17. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 10/17/2023

10/17/2023

Order Issued This case has generated substantial public interest and media attention. In light of this, and on the Court's own motion to ensure the integrity of the proceedings, to protect the Defendant's constitutional rights for due process, to ensure the safety of the parties and the public, and to permit public access to criminal proceedings, the Court sets forth the following rules and guidelines for the hearing set for Thursday, October 19, 2023, in the Allen Superior Court. The Courthouse will open at 8:00 a.m. All entrances are closed, except for the entrance on the east side of the building. The remaining entrances are locked with no access to the public. All members of the public, including members of the media, are subject to screening by metal detectors. All bags in possession of those entering the building are subject to search. NO weapons of any kind are permitted in the building, except for on-duty law enforcement officers providing security to the Courthouse and the parties. Cellular telephones are NOT permitted in the building. Violations are subject to seizure and destruction of the cellular telephone. No electronic equipment or devices are permitted in the Allen County Courthouse. This includes electronic watches. Media personnel are permitted to attend the Court session. One or two cameras providing pool coverage will be permitted in the Court session. No still photography or other recording will be permitted. No other media equipment will be permitted in the Courthouse. The Court requests the media be mindful that other County offices are conducting business in the building unrelated to this case. Media and members of the public are ordered to conduct themselves in such a fashion as to limit disruption to the offices, personnel, and patrons of those offices. The Media are free to use the public areas outside the Courthouse as long as they do not obstruct traffic in the streets and sidewalks surrounding the Courthouse. Public seating in the Allen Superior Courtroom One is limited to 90 spectators. The Sheriff of Allen County or his designee will ensure that the victim representatives are seated and that the defendant's family is seated. The first two rows of public seating in the south side of the Coutroom will be reserved for the State, the State's staff, victims representatives, and State designees. The first two rows of public seating in the north side of the Courtroom will be reserved for the defense staff, defense family, and defense designees. The remaining seating is available until full. No one, other than Court Security and law enforcement, will be permitted to stand in the Courtroom. No food or beverages are permitted inside Allen Superior Court. Water will be permitted for the parties in the well of the Courtroom. All members of the public and the media are required to follow directives of the Sheriff of Carroll County, the Sheriff of Allen County, Courthouse Security, and Courtroom Security. NO court-produced recording will be made available to the public or media. The audio record made pursuant to Indiana Criminal Rule 5 may not be copied or used for purposes other than perpetuating the record. At the conclusion of the scheduled hearing, all members of the public and media will remain seated in the courtroom until Court Security releases them. The Court anticipates that all members of the public and the media will conduct themselves in an appropriate fashion. Any violation of this Order and any conduct the Court finds disruptive of the proceedings may result in an order of temporary or permanent exclusion from the Courtroom and/or Courthouse and is punishable as contempt of Court. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 10/17/2023

 

[GrandmaBear]

Also BG is too tall to be RA who's 5'4".

I'm not convinced of that but even if it's not Allen, then Allen is down the hill already and how did some other guy miss the girls and woman, etc. It also still doesn't make it Os.

But for now, it is RA for me on the bridge. No one has proven the height thing to me yet, I will wait and see on that one.

Also my ex was taller in his boots than in his bare feet. Sorry but short men also often wear shoes for height/to appear taller just as women do and RA likely was bothered by his height...

I have a pair of Hokas for work, never heard of them until I needed a TOP shoe for work as my feet couldn't take it and went to a bona fide shoe store where they still measure your feet and put the shoes on you old school style rather than self service but nothing old school about their shoes. I could ill afford them $1i65) but they were a necessity for work. I had never heard of Hokas but now that I have them I notice them often on others.

Sp these aren't even FOR height, it is for padding and shock absorption. Take a look and tell me these don't add inches and they aren't boots or high heels. An athletic shoe no less. In talking of this, I'd be interested in the type of shoes and boots found of RA's...

 

[GrandmaBear]

Kline wasted their time for 5 years. Finally they nailed Kline and then were able to arrest Allen. There is a link between Kline and Allen. Not sure exactly what it is yet (something to do with the Anthony Shots profile IMO).
Ron Logan drove himself to Lafayette but lied about it by saying someone drove him. However he was caught on camera driving himself to the dump that day. LE prosecuted and jailed him for that.

BTW Kline is appealing his sentence, I think I read. Will find link.

Kline appeal link

Kegan Kline appealing 40-year sentence in child pornography case

In March, Kline pleaded guilty to 25 charges, ranging from child exploitation and possession of child pornography to obstruction of justice.

www.wthr.com

Kline link explaining the run around and time wasting that he gave LE.

Police Say Delphi Murders Investigation Is ‘Extremely Complicated,’ ID Mysterious Catfish | Oxygen Official Site

Though investigators have publicly identified a man accused of creating a fake social media profile to commit child sex crimes, they’re keeping tight-lipped as to whether or not the alleged catfish has definitively been tied to the murder of two teen girls.

www.oxygen.com

I think so too. I don't think Kline was necessarily there but somehow they link.... Kline was to meet with LIbby at the bridge on the Feb date. RA found the girls on the bridge and he was there instead.... THAT is just too uncanny to mean nothing. Just picture a pedo group talking on the dark web or in another way and saying who is going, who wants this, maybe even let's draw straws, girl is expecting Anthonyl Shotz etc but boy will she be surprised...

Just one possible scenario. I don't know but the Kline thing far more than the O thing fits. Unless all are both things pedo and O lol and then we really have farfetched...

 

[GrandmaBear]

Still watching. A couple of things so far:

Thanks, this is Firm 22:

Firm 22

Firm 22 is the name used by the Vinlanders Social Club, a racist skinhead group, to refer to supporters and associates of the group who are not actually members. The number 22 stands for the letter V.

www.adl.org

Also, the flag in the background is an original U.S. Flag. Racists often say they want the country to revert to its original form.

It used to be God and Country. I'd sure like to know how those claiming to be white nationalists (US) with our flag decided a Norse god is who they should worship with European roots etc. Our country from settling has been GOD and Country not ODIN and Country. Stupid dumbarses.

Natives were here first of course so reverting to its original form isn't what they think, however, I'm sure they mean since whites came and settled and it became a country but again that was not with in ODIN we trust... Sounds honestly more stupid than I have words for.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

It used to be God and Country. I'd sure like to know how those claiming to be white nationalists (US) with our flag decided a Norse god is who they should worship with European roots etc. Our country from settling has been GOD and Country not ODIN and Country. Stupid dumbarses.

Natives were here first of course so reverting to its original form isn't what they think, however, I'm sure they mean since whites came and settled and it became a country but again that was not with in ODIN we trust... Sounds honestly more stupid than I have words for.

We aren't talking about Mensa members. I'm just finishing up with video and when someone asks about the flag behind him, he refuses to answer. He says people can look it up online. That's just gonna tell you it's the original U.S. Flag attributed to Betsy Ross.

 

[GrandmaBear]

parking th Court cameras link here; see Carroll County:

IN Court Streams - IN Court Streams

Indiana Supreme Court, Public Access

public.courts.in.gov

Court Orders - Judge says cameras allowed Thursday and onwards.
Orders below re: Cameras/Media, etc..

Order Issued The Court has received multiple requests for various legitimate media outlets to record the Court proceedings to be conducted on October 19, 2023, at 2:00 p.m. (These requests are filed in the case with this Order). Pursuant to the Code of Judicial Conduct, Rule 2.17, a judge shall prohibit broadcasting, televising, recording, or taking photographs in the Courtroom. However, a judge may authorize the broadcasting, televising, recording, digital streaming, or photographing of court proceedings or the Courtroom by members of the news media under certain conditions. (Rule 2.17(3)(a)(b)). News media is defined as persons employed by or representing a newspaper, periodical, press association, radio station, television station, or wire service and covered by I.C. 34-46-4-1. All of the submitted requests meet this definition. Counsel for the State and the defense have been provided with these requests, and both have previously submitted pleadings stating their positions on cameras in the Courtroom. (See defense Motion for Broadcasting Order, filed September 13, 2023, and State's Response to Defendant's Motion for Broadcasting Order, filed September 25, 2023). The Court has determined that allowing recording of the October 19, 2023, hearing is permitted provided that the means of recording will not distract the participants or impair the dignity of the proceedings, and the hearing itself is a non-confidential proceeding. The Court, therefore, authorizes the recording and broadcasting of the hearing set for October 19, 2023. The Court WILL NOT permit photographing or digital streaming of the proceedings. All news media will be required to wear/display identification and to wear appropriate attire. One or two cameras will be authorized for pool coverage of the hearing. Members of the general public are prohibited from broadcasting, recording, or photographing this proceeding. The Court will prohibit media broadcast during this hearing of attorney-client communications, bench conferences, and materials on counsel tables and the Court's bench. The Court has the sole discretion to interrupt or stop the coverage, or to limit or terminate the recording and broadcast by a news media organization at any time during the proceeding. The Court requests the media to become familiar with I.C. 34-46-4-1 and the Code of Judicial Conduct, Rule 2.17. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 10/17/2023

10/17/2023

Order Issued This case has generated substantial public interest and media attention. In light of this, and on the Court's own motion to ensure the integrity of the proceedings, to protect the Defendant's constitutional rights for due process, to ensure the safety of the parties and the public, and to permit public access to criminal proceedings, the Court sets forth the following rules and guidelines for the hearing set for Thursday, October 19, 2023, in the Allen Superior Court. The Courthouse will open at 8:00 a.m. All entrances are closed, except for the entrance on the east side of the building. The remaining entrances are locked with no access to the public. All members of the public, including members of the media, are subject to screening by metal detectors. All bags in possession of those entering the building are subject to search. NO weapons of any kind are permitted in the building, except for on-duty law enforcement officers providing security to the Courthouse and the parties. Cellular telephones are NOT permitted in the building. Violations are subject to seizure and destruction of the cellular telephone. No electronic equipment or devices are permitted in the Allen County Courthouse. This includes electronic watches. Media personnel are permitted to attend the Court session. One or two cameras providing pool coverage will be permitted in the Court session. No still photography or other recording will be permitted. No other media equipment will be permitted in the Courthouse. The Court requests the media be mindful that other County offices are conducting business in the building unrelated to this case. Media and members of the public are ordered to conduct themselves in such a fashion as to limit disruption to the offices, personnel, and patrons of those offices. The Media are free to use the public areas outside the Courthouse as long as they do not obstruct traffic in the streets and sidewalks surrounding the Courthouse. Public seating in the Allen Superior Courtroom One is limited to 90 spectators. The Sheriff of Allen County or his designee will ensure that the victim representatives are seated and that the defendant's family is seated. The first two rows of public seating in the south side of the Coutroom will be reserved for the State, the State's staff, victims representatives, and State designees. The first two rows of public seating in the north side of the Courtroom will be reserved for the defense staff, defense family, and defense designees. The remaining seating is available until full. No one, other than Court Security and law enforcement, will be permitted to stand in the Courtroom. No food or beverages are permitted inside Allen Superior Court. Water will be permitted for the parties in the well of the Courtroom. All members of the public and the media are required to follow directives of the Sheriff of Carroll County, the Sheriff of Allen County, Courthouse Security, and Courtroom Security. NO court-produced recording will be made available to the public or media. The audio record made pursuant to Indiana Criminal Rule 5 may not be copied or used for purposes other than perpetuating the record. At the conclusion of the scheduled hearing, all members of the public and media will remain seated in the courtroom until Court Security releases them. The Court anticipates that all members of the public and the media will conduct themselves in an appropriate fashion. Any violation of this Order and any conduct the Court finds disruptive of the proceedings may result in an order of temporary or permanent exclusion from the Courtroom and/or Courthouse and is punishable as contempt of Court. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Order Signed: 10/17/2023

Hmm I'm a bit confused so it will be streamed live by pool cameras or it won't? I read it all other than the attachments which I assume were the same thing, different way to access. It says recording and broadcasting is allowed but not digital streaming so are they saying only by a news camera? I kind of thought most broadcasting is "digital" these days which is where it confuses me. Overall I take it as it will be broadcast live?

I am off that day but have plans. I may need to think about changing them but not sure I can, it is a must need do thing and never enough time to take care of all. Is this the Franks hearing that day or something else?

 

[Cousin Dupree]

I'm not convinced of that but even if it's not Allen, then Allen is down the hill already and how did some other guy miss the girls and woman, etc. It also still doesn't make it Os.

But for now, it is RA for me on the bridge. No one has proven the height thing to me yet, I will wait and see on that one.

Also my ex was taller in his boots than in his bare feet. Sorry but short men also often wear shoes for height/to appear taller just as women do and RA likely was bothered by his height...

I have a pair of Hokas for work, never heard of them until I needed a TOP shoe for work as my feet couldn't take it and went to a bona fide shoe store where they still measure your feet and put the shoes on you old school style rather than self service but nothing old school about their shoes. I could ill afford them $1i65) but they were a necessity for work. I had never heard of Hokas but now that I have them I notice them often on others.

Sp these aren't even FOR height, it is for padding and shock absorption. Take a look and tell me these don't add inches and they aren't boots or high heels. An athletic shoe no less. In talking of this, I'd be interested in the type of shoes and boots found of RA's...

View attachment 20451View attachment 20452

The FBI estimates his height at 5'10" give or take a half inch. If he's 5'10" then RA would have to be wearing six inch heels. BG is not wearing six inch heels, and they'd be very difficult to walk in on flat pavement. This guy is walking on a bridge large holes between the slats. I am absolutely convinced that RA is NOT BG. IMO, BG is Ron Logan.

 

[GrandmaBear]

We aren't talking about Mensa members. I'm just finishing up with video and when someone asks about the flag behind him, he refuses to answer. He says people can look it up online. That's just gonna tell you it's the original U.S. Flag attributed to Betsy Ross.

I know we are not talking Mensa members and you know who I keep thinking of when reading this sh*t? The McDaniels in Arbery. Not so smart, feel they are superior, white, etc. BUT they still don't set out to plan a murder, they are just white redneck idiots. You know I rooted for everything they got and they deserved it but it isn't the same as what was done to thee girls. My point is someone planned this didn't just all hotheaded spur of the moment, etc., etc. go do something stupid. My point IS this group or some of these men sound like the same kind of thing. Big talk, patches, claims, FB, etc. but I don't believe for a minute they were sacrificing these girls in some ritual in broad daylight. A bunch of stupid heads for the most part. It would take some brains to plan what was alleged here and get away with it and you just said yourself, not talking Mensa members.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

it's not a available to me either but just read the article instead, if you want.

I have another interesting link. A very recent interview with PW.

In the video Westfall says he thinks the murderers are local government officials including police. He does not believe RA is the killer. I say that he believes RA is innocent, because it's implied by his answer. I don't even think RA is totally innocent.

His avoidance of whether or not his "social club" is racist is interesting. He says something to the effect of: There are black groups, Hispanic groups... He never comes out and says they aren't racist. I think it's more than fair to say he's a white supremacist. What does that have to do with the Delphi murders, I don't know if it has anything to do with them, but his avoidance of answering the question is interesting.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

I had a cat once that looked like a miniature panther. He was still a cat.

Bodies fall, get covered up in haste. Tree limbs are not perfectly straight. Rest a bloody hand on a tree. It leaves a mark.

If you look hard enough, you can find images in anything.

I'm just saying.

THAT said, there is still something weird about this case. These attorneys are not new to the scene and have quite the caseload. They aren't slouches.

The friend who sent this to me knew I didn't want to see the death pictures. So they sent me this video which has the stick figure drawings and some explanation. In the Westfall video it's brought up that one of the pieces of wood had been cleanly cut. I think it's the largest one in the stick figure drawings.

I haven't watched the entire video. The stick figure drawing analysis begins at 20:28

 

[Olenna]

It used to be God and Country. I'd sure like to know how those claiming to be white nationalists (US) with our flag decided a Norse god is who they should worship with European roots etc. Our country from settling has been GOD and Country not ODIN and Country. Stupid dumbarses.

Natives were here first of course so reverting to its original form isn't what they think, however, I'm sure they mean since whites came and settled and it became a country but again that was not with in ODIN we trust... Sounds honestly more stupid than I have words for.

The Nazis did the same sh...t.
Just another white supremacy cult thang.

 

[Olenna]

The FBI estimates his height at 5'10" give or take a half inch. If he's 5'10" then RA would have to be wearing six inch heels. BG is not wearing six inch heels, and they'd be very difficult to walk in on flat pavement. This guy is walking on a bridge large holes between the slats. I am absolutely convinced that RA is NOT BG. IMO, BG is Ron Logan.

I feel like the witnesses who provided info for the artist renderings of BG know if BG was of short stature.

 

[GrandmaBear]

The FBI estimates his height at 5'10" give or take a half inch. If he's 5'10" then RA would have to be wearing six inch heels. BG is not wearing six inch heels, and they'd be very difficult to walk in on flat pavement. This guy is walking on a bridge large holes between the slats. I am absolutely convinced that RA is NOT BG. IMO, BG is Ron Logan.

Well emu it has been awhile but I've seen things on the height but don't know where they've went since then since I've had on time. I do know many are confident it is Allen on the bridge and experts as well, why s that if it can't be due to height? I don't know. You are going to the extreme side of what various opinions are out there I had heard some time back as to the height difference. Are you quoting the defense or who?

One thing I do recall is right on or after arrest there were two different heights for Allen. For some reason I recall 5'8 BG and RA 5'6 by some accounts. And that's two inches but I am not fresh on it and here you say SIX inches which I don't buy for a minute. No expert but not one thing about that video we all have watched millions of times made me think BG was 5'10! He looks and still looks an average of 5'7 to 5'8 to me at tallest. BG I mean. His nose, the round face, none of that is Logan.

I also don't think the defense brings in Logan or do they?

You KNOW that like you I haven't dismissed Logan BUT there isn't any reason to be sure of him either. There IS much to suggest some link of Kline and Allen. And now you've added Os. Which is it for you, Os or pedos? And you think RL was one of which one or both? And RA one or both? And is/was Kline an O too??? You kind of have thrown all the theories into the pot and added the new one into the rest as one big group? An O pedo ring? Hey who knows...

You say you are convinced it was RL on the bridge. I'm not. I"m also not convinced he was involved at all BUT I do have that at 50/50 at BEST and probably less. I've never felt him the guy on the bridge though. I have thought of whomever chasing them to Loga's for others and some bigger plan... So what is it you think? LOGAN parked at the lformer CPS or whatever it was building and then went and walked the trail and bridge and chased the girls down the hill towards his property? And then what? Went back and got his vehicle how? The guy was hiding the fact he drove and trying not to be caught doing so and so...? If he walked from his home to the trails and then around and back he would have been seen by the witnesses no? It just doesn't add up... I do think the fact it is his property near there lends to us and others and man I wish he hand't lied on top of it because that's all put together what is hard to let go of. He also hated the area being changed and warned of it and that makes one wonder...

I am sidetracking but as to him so not really, but point i want to make is how do you think he got there, on the bridge, walked, parked, from what direction, and did he know the girls would be there and did he plan this or just happenstance etc. or you picture BOTH RA and Os down the hill and Logan sending the girls to that crazy mixed group? No offense but you are kind of throwing all various people into it now no?

 

[Olenna]

Hmm I'm a bit confused so it will be streamed live by pool cameras or it won't? I read it all other than the attachments which I assume were the same thing, different way to access. It says recording and broadcasting is allowed but not digital streaming so are they saying only by a news camera? I kind of thought most broadcasting is "digital" these days which is where it confuses me. Overall I take it as it will be broadcast live?

I am off that day but have plans. I may need to think about changing them but not sure I can, it is a must need do thing and never enough time to take care of all. Is this the Franks hearing that day or something else?

I was hoping someone here could answer that same question GrandmaBear. I worry it's for the press feed ... into another room (b/c they won't all fit in the courtroom). The press can - that way - watch the trial in the overflow area?

But maybe it is for broadcasting later ... just not live broadcast?

I HAVE NO IDEA.
I'm just an old dead queen and in my day we had no "television".
"Broadcast" references net-fishing in the chilly bay (not netflixing and chill) and "streaming" means ... git yer arse in the river and get that stank off ya.

 

[GrandmaBear]

The FBI estimates his height at 5'10" give or take a half inch. If he's 5'10" then RA would have to be wearing six inch heels. BG is not wearing six inch heels, and they'd be very difficult to walk in on flat pavement. This guy is walking on a bridge large holes between the slats. I am absolutely convinced that RA is NOT BG. IMO, BG is Ron Logan.

Yeah the guy is also all bundled up for a midwest guy where most of us, as Abby and Libby did, ditch all that on a warmer than norm Feb day especially when walking and moving. My ex (midwest) wouldn't be caught dead in a sweatshirt and coat and hat and more on a day like that. I wouldn't either. Ye he owned/owns all the same kind of clothing but you wouldn't wear it on a day over 20 for sure, he never did at 10 degrees. So let's just say or assume he wanted to be nondescript and was covering for a reason or a few reasons, to look nondescript, his real clothing, typical midwest rural wear, but again not on a day like that, so he did not alarm them too far ahead of time even though I am sure they quickly realized he wasn't Anthony Shotz, etc. He planned this. And so yeah, outfit and all. Height, walk, covered up with clothing , head down...

 

[Cousin Dupree]

Well emu it has been awhile but I've seen things on the height but don't know where they've went since then since I've had on time. I do know many are confident it is Allen on the bridge and experts as well, why s that if it can't be due to height? I don't know. You are going to the extreme side of what various opinions are out there I had heard some time back as to the height difference. Are you quoting the defense or who?

One thing I do recall is right on or after arrest there were two different heights for Allen. For some reason I recall 5'8 BG and RA 5'6 by some accounts. And that's two inches but I am not fresh on it and here you say SIX inches which I don't buy for a minute. No expert but not one thing about that video we all have watched millions of times made me think BG was 5'10! He looks and still looks an average of 5'7 to 5'8 to me at tallest. BG I mean. His nose, the round face, none of that is Logan.

I also don't think the defense brings in Logan or do they?

You KNOW that like you I haven't dismissed Logan BUT there isn't any reason to be sure of him either. There IS much to suggest some link of Kline and Allen. And now you've added Os. Which is it for you, Os or pedos? And you think RL was one of which one or both? And RA one or both? And is/was Kline an O too??? You kind of have thrown all the theories into the pot and added the new one into the rest as one big group? An O pedo ring? Hey who knows...

You say you are convinced it was RL on the bridge. I'm not. I"m also not convinced he was involved at all BUT I do have that at 50/50 at BEST and probably less. I've never felt him the guy on the bridge though. I have thought of whomever chasing them to Loga's for others and some bigger plan... So what is it you think? LOGAN parked at the lformer CPS or whatever it was building and then went and walked the trail and bridge and chased the girls down the hill towards his property? And then what? Went back and got his vehicle how? The guy was hiding the fact he drove and trying not to be caught doing so and so...? If he walked from his home to the trails and then around and back he would have been seen by the witnesses no? It just doesn't add up... I do think the fact it is his property near there lends to us and others and man I wish he hand't lied on top of it because that's all put together what is hard to let go of. He also hated the area being changed and warned of it and that makes one wonder...

I am sidetracking but as to him so not really, but point i want to make is how do you think he got there, on the bridge, walked, parked, from what direction, and did he know the girls would be there and did he plan this or just happenstance etc. or you picture BOTH RA and Os down the hill and Logan sending the girls to that crazy mixed group? No offense but you are kind of throwing all various people into it now no?

Two different people, at different times who knew Ron Logan were shown the video of bridge guy and before being asked anything they identified the guy as Ron Logan. How Logan got there, I don't know, but I'm sure it's him.

I'm also sure that there were people waiting for the kids down the hill.

 

[RoundPeg]

The friend who sent this to me knew I didn't want to see the death pictures. So they sent me this video which has the stick figure drawings and some explanation. In the Westfall video it's brought up that one of the pieces of wood had been cleanly cut. I think it's the largest one in the stick figure drawings.

I haven't watched the entire video. The stick figure drawing analysis begins at 20:28

I've seen some stock figure renderings. I don’t know if it's the same ones in the video. But it still is just as likely it was random, in my way of thinking.