JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell *GUILTY*

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Police seem to be no closer to finding 7-year-old Joshua “JJ” Vallow and 17-year-old Tylee Ryan than they were when this story began months ago.

Since that time, the story has gained international attention as it’s taken twists and turns involving a purported cult, dead spouses, delusions of divinity and preparing for the end of the world. Despite all the angles, and the ever-growing number of people related to the case, the facts remain essentially the same as when it was first announced.

The two children remain missing and the parents, Lori (Vallow) Daybell, and her new husband, Chad Daybell, refuse to disclose their whereabouts to police. Both have been named persons of interest in the disappearance of the children. Law enforcement is also investigating the deaths of the Daybells’ previous respective spouses, Charles Vallow and Tammy Daybell, though neither Chad nor Lori have been named suspects in those cases.

Written timeline of events
  • April 3, 2018 - Tylee Ryan's father, Joseph Ryan, dies. Death ruled heart attack.
  • December 2018 - Chad Daybell & Lori Vallow make first appearance on Preparing a People podcast.
  • February 2019 - Charles Vallow files for divorce from Lori, claiming she viewed herself as a god preparing for the second coming, and she would kill him if he got in her way.
  • February - April 2019 - Lori disappears for nearly two months, leaving her children with others.
  • June 2019 - Lori's niece demands a divorce from her husband, who says she shares similar beliefs to her aunt.
  • July 11, 2019 - Charles Vallow shot and killed by Lori's brother Alex Cox. Shooting initially ruled self-defense.
  • August 2019 - Lori moves to Rexburg, Idaho with kids
  • September 3, 2019 - Joshua "JJ" Vallow enrolled in school
  • September 23, 2019 - JJ last attended school
  • September 24, 2019 - Lori unenrolls JJ from school, saying she would be homeschooling him.
  • September 2019 - Tylee also seen in September, but it's unclear when and where (she had graduated early)
  • October 2, 2019 - Lori's niece's ex-husband was shot at, missing his head by inches. Shooter was driving a vehicle registered to Charles Vallow.
  • October 9, 2019 - Tammy Daybell, Chad's wife, called 911 and said a masked man shot at her with a paintball gun.
  • October 19, 2019 - Tammy Daybell dies, death is ruled natural
  • October 25, 2019 - Tylee, or someone using her phone, texts a friend
  • Late October / Early November 2019 - Chad Daybell & Lori Vallow get married
  • November 26, 2019 - Welfare check requested for JJ at the request of extended family - police are told he is in Arizona with family, but he is not
  • November 27, 2019 - Police return to serve a search warrant, finding the Daybell's gone
  • December 12, 2019 - Lori's brother, who had shot her ex-husband, dies mysteriously in Arizona
  • December 20, 2019 - Search for JJ and Tylee goes public
  • December 30, 2019 - LE says Lori knows where her children are but will not cooperate
  • January 25, 2020 - Chad & Lori are located in Hawaii, served with a notice that she must produce the children within 5 days
  • January 30, 2020 - Lori fails to produce JJ and Tylee

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edited by staff to add new media link
 
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Of course, his kids were never “dark”!
Before his kids should consider themselves loved by dad or special to him, they need to realize if they weren't the type to toe the line or cost him money or shame or trouble, I don't doubt they would have received a dark rating if he couldn't get them under control. However, no doubt he raised them as controlled little minions. I just think of the way he took JJ upstairs to discipline him no doubt...

Maybe his were special to him and he would only get rid of hers, quite possible, but I'm not so sure... This man cared little about anyone and he didn't care enough about his kids to not put them through this and he took their mother away, and a lot more. He well could have been an abusive father and husband, we really have no idea.
 
Been watching today's testimonies on the East Idaho News website and it's explosive!

Just spent quite a bit of time reading it all. Although we know of a lot as to the podcast and such, hearing from the Gilberts was interesting, very. Some of those details we had heard before too but I don't know that they necessarily came from them as to how we heard them. Like that Lori's daughter was dead, etc.
 

Below are the movements of Alex's phone from Sep 9th to 25th as shown in the thread reader link I previously posted - link is shown again above.

Wright says he could not identify much of anything to investigate with the Yellowstone trip - everything seemed normal and Wright is confidence Tylee returned to the apartment.
After Alex's device returns to Lori's apartment, it goes to a Maverik gas station for ten minutes around 9:43 p.m. It then goes back to Lori's apartment from and then to Alex's apartment.
There are several data points on Alex's device in Lori's apartment early on Sept. 9 - from 2:42 a.m. until 8:49 a.m.
Wright says he observed all the activity on Alex's device for the month of September. Alex was often in Lori's apartment from around 8 - midnight and then the device would go into Alex's apartment. It would stay there until morning or sometimes at late as noon.
"This was the only time I observed it go to apartment 175 between the hours of midnight and 6 a.m."
An overhead map is now shown of the apartment complex and Wright points out the distance between Alex and Lori's apartments - around 80 meters.
Other data points were recorded on Alex's phone at 4:37 a.m., 4:39 a.m., 4:41 a.m., 5:14 a.m., 6:47 a.m. and 8:49 a.m.
On Monday, Sept. 9, the device departs Alex's apartment at 9 a.m. It travels north to Chad Daybell's house - eight miles north of the apartment - and arrives around 9:15 a.m.
Numerous data points were recorded between 9:15 a.m. - 9:45 a.m. at the Daybell residence, Wright says. Lori is taking notes as Wright speaks. Some of the jurors are too. By 11:45 a.m., the device is traveling southbound and returns to Rexburg.
At 11:52 a.m., it stops at Del Taco for ten minutes.
There were four major data points Wright observed during the time period Alex was at the Daybell property. A data point appears at the shed at 9:21 a.m. with a 6-meter radius margin of error.
At 9:22 a.m., there is a data point at a gate into the property (you can drive onto the property at this gate). No quality data points are received until 9:39 a.m. and another data point is received at 10:57 a.m.
Wright agains mentions the gate allowed a vehicle to drive onto the back part of the property.

We now see the raccoon text Chad sent to Tammy on Monday, Sept. 9 at 11:53 a.m. telling her he had been burning limb debris when he saw a raccoon and had to kill and bury it in the family pet cemetery.
Coupled with the text and data points by the fire pit, "this certainly set up some red flags for us."

We now see a slide showing the activity from Alex's device on Sept. 22 - the last time JJ was seen alive. "There was some traffic with the device," Wright says. Alex went back and forth between Lori's apartment and his apartment between 4:29 p.m. and 12:11 a.m.
Alex's device doesn't move from his apartment between 12:11 a.m. and 9:41 a.m. on Sept. 23. At 9:41 a.m., the device travels from the apartments Chad Daybell's home where it arrives at 9:55 a.m.
By 10:12 a.m., Alex's device departs the residence southbound until Rexburg and goes to Lori's apartment at 10:22 a.m. It stays there until 11:14 a.m.
Two data points were found near the pond on Chad's property between 9:55 a.m. and 10:02 a.m. Other data points were recorded at the house's front door.
Wright points out on a Google Earth image where Alex's data points were recorded on Chad's property.

Wright says Alex's phone was at or near the Daybell residence four times in September 2019. On Sept. 6, Sept. 9, Sept. 23 and Sept. 25.
Alex Cox visited Dan's Window Tinting in Rexburg on Sept. 23 for about five minutes. He visited the store twice on Sept. 25.
Isn't Lori's alibi that she couldn't have done it as she was in her own apartment at the time of the "kids" deaths"....? Yet this all places Alex in her apartment and soooo if she is claiming Alex did it then she was home and aware of it and it was at her apartment... I mean it doesn't fly... It may not be the case exactly but it doesn't hold water...
 
They are on lunch break right now and WOW. I'm going to wait and see what you guys think. Bottom line for me is that the evidence keeps stacking up high against Lori as a co-conspirator in the murder of her children!!!!!
Significant pieces today if you ask me from what I've read so far... I may not need to watch Nate as I read every tweet of his... They are doing a FANTASTIC job but of course it helps to have all of this BUT they also went and got it all, have lined it all up and now are tying it all up piece by piece to put a final bow on it with closing argument eventually...
 
Boyce will allow the bit with Lori.


I'm not real sure of why the prosecution had a problem with this or why Archibald wanted it other than to show Lori's beliefs. It actually kind of damns her if they had went to the part of finding out it was okay to kill Joe (I know it didn't play that far)... I don't really see where it hurts the prosecution or helps the defense...
 
The fact he told the Gilberts that Tylee was dead (apparently in front of Lori) is another one of the zingers that would stand out to me as a juror.
Yeah add that in to the number of times he told people he wasn't married or knew Lori (to cops), that they were going to get married but already were, and that her ONE child was dead and her hub had a heart attack, etc. and boy oh boy. Just that alone... She said such things as well...

CONSPIRACY throughout.
 
I'm not real sure of why the prosecution had a problem with this or why Archibald wanted it other than to show Lori's beliefs. It actually kind of damns her if they had went to the part of finding out it was okay to kill Joe (I know it didn't play that far)... I don't really see where it hurts the prosecution or helps the defense...
They all just basically said they were warriors. Each had some bad times and were saved by Jesus to become a warrior.

Boyce did not want the bit played where she mentions Joe Ryan apparently. Not sure why. I guess it is prejudicial?

This is what the judge said.
https://twitter.com/PrettyLiesAlibi
Pretty Lies & Alibis
@PrettyLiesAlibi
·
13h

Lindsey Blake says the defendant is barred from entering in her own statements. Judge Boyce says it depends on what the statements are #lorivallow
@LawCrimeNetwork
 
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Isn't Lori's alibi that she couldn't have done it as she was in her own apartment at the time of the "kids" deaths"....? Yet this all places Alex in her apartment and soooo if she is claiming Alex did it then she was home and aware of it and it was at her apartment... I mean it doesn't fly... It may not be the case exactly but it doesn't hold water...
Very good point.

First, how does she even know the time of the kids' deaths? Unless she was involved.

Second. Have LE given a TOD even? I don't think so. We only know the burial times AFAIK.
 
If Lori is found guilty of conspiracy, then it will go without saying that Chad is guilty too won't it? At the very least anyway.
I think so. I mean different jury, different trial and he could be found guilty or not, but just on the face of it, it would certainly mean I think that this jury thought him guilty if they find her guilty. It is TOO bad they weren't tried together as that would have done it I believe. They have more evidence overall on him I'd say.

Thing is his trial could end up years away and in fact it could end up being a wholly different prosecution team, a different defense lawyer, etc.

I think the evidence has become overwhelming. It becomes a triangle that continuously comes back to the other. I think they are well beyond a reasonable doubt. A juror would have to ignore way too much to find her not guilty or any of them for that matter.

Anytime one accepts a fact that yeah, it is obvious Chad did this or was involved in that, my mind then goes well of course then Lori knew too because the overall goal of the two of them was to be together, be obstacle free, etc. Any time one is labeled dark by Chad, that person ends up dead and the pattern is seen with both Lori and Chad. Any time a connection is shown on the right day and time between Chad and Alex, naturally then it comes back to Lori knowing and being involved as she shops for rings while they try to take Tammy out on two occasions, succeeding on the second one and just soooo much more than I for one can put into words here.

Many think Chad will deal if she is convicted by I'm not so sure. They could also just delay until the end of time or try to. Of course he ends up staying in county should they do that and I don't see him wanting that either but it is the way of many cases...

I think the prosecution has done a fantastic job and will continue to right through closing and she will be found guilty (and if they do the same job with him, he will too) however, I don't think unfortunately this case is free of appeal bases, whether they'd win on the bases or one of them, I'm not sure but I think a few exist...
 

Below are the movements of Alex's phone from Sep 9th to 25th as shown in the thread reader link I previously posted - link is shown again above.

Wright says he could not identify much of anything to investigate with the Yellowstone trip - everything seemed normal and Wright is confidence Tylee returned to the apartment.
After Alex's device returns to Lori's apartment, it goes to a Maverik gas station for ten minutes around 9:43 p.m. It then goes back to Lori's apartment from and then to Alex's apartment.
There are several data points on Alex's device in Lori's apartment early on Sept. 9 - from 2:42 a.m. until 8:49 a.m.
Wright says he observed all the activity on Alex's device for the month of September. Alex was often in Lori's apartment from around 8 - midnight and then the device would go into Alex's apartment. It would stay there until morning or sometimes at late as noon.
"This was the only time I observed it go to apartment 175 between the hours of midnight and 6 a.m."
An overhead map is now shown of the apartment complex and Wright points out the distance between Alex and Lori's apartments - around 80 meters.
Other data points were recorded on Alex's phone at 4:37 a.m., 4:39 a.m., 4:41 a.m., 5:14 a.m., 6:47 a.m. and 8:49 a.m.
On Monday, Sept. 9, the device departs Alex's apartment at 9 a.m. It travels north to Chad Daybell's house - eight miles north of the apartment - and arrives around 9:15 a.m.
Numerous data points were recorded between 9:15 a.m. - 9:45 a.m. at the Daybell residence, Wright says. Lori is taking notes as Wright speaks. Some of the jurors are too. By 11:45 a.m., the device is traveling southbound and returns to Rexburg.
At 11:52 a.m., it stops at Del Taco for ten minutes.
There were four major data points Wright observed during the time period Alex was at the Daybell property. A data point appears at the shed at 9:21 a.m. with a 6-meter radius margin of error.
At 9:22 a.m., there is a data point at a gate into the property (you can drive onto the property at this gate). No quality data points are received until 9:39 a.m. and another data point is received at 10:57 a.m.
Wright agains mentions the gate allowed a vehicle to drive onto the back part of the property.

We now see the raccoon text Chad sent to Tammy on Monday, Sept. 9 at 11:53 a.m. telling her he had been burning limb debris when he saw a raccoon and had to kill and bury it in the family pet cemetery.
Coupled with the text and data points by the fire pit, "this certainly set up some red flags for us."

We now see a slide showing the activity from Alex's device on Sept. 22 - the last time JJ was seen alive. "There was some traffic with the device," Wright says. Alex went back and forth between Lori's apartment and his apartment between 4:29 p.m. and 12:11 a.m.
Alex's device doesn't move from his apartment between 12:11 a.m. and 9:41 a.m. on Sept. 23. At 9:41 a.m., the device travels from the apartments Chad Daybell's home where it arrives at 9:55 a.m.
By 10:12 a.m., Alex's device departs the residence southbound until Rexburg and goes to Lori's apartment at 10:22 a.m. It stays there until 11:14 a.m.
Two data points were found near the pond on Chad's property between 9:55 a.m. and 10:02 a.m. Other data points were recorded at the house's front door.
Wright points out on a Google Earth image where Alex's data points were recorded on Chad's property.

Wright says Alex's phone was at or near the Daybell residence four times in September 2019. On Sept. 6, Sept. 9, Sept. 23 and Sept. 25.
Alex Cox visited Dan's Window Tinting in Rexburg on Sept. 23 for about five minutes. He visited the store twice on Sept. 25.
I am repeating the link and the copy of the testimony from after the Sep 25th date. On Oct 9th, it seems that Alex parked in a small pull in behind Chad and Tammy's house the day of the "paintball", which explains why he ran off to the rear of the property. There is also evidence showing his purchases, including a ski mask as described by Tammy. There is also proof of his attempted murder on Brandon.

Here's the significant dates again as a reminder-

Sep 9 Tylee's death, dismemberment, burning and burial. Raccoon text.
Sep 23 JJ's death and burial
Oct 2 failed shooting on Brandon
Oct 2 Lori purchases wedding ring
Oct 3 Tammy's dead Grandma visits Chad
Oct 4 and 5 Tammy visits Springfield
Oct 9 failed shooting by man in ski mask
Oct 19 Tammy's death
Oct 23 Tammy's funeral
Nov 5 beach wedding


"We now see the image of the Jeep used in Brandon Boudreaux's Arizona shooting. It has tinted windows. Police searched the vehicle after it was seized and two receipts were found inside. One was from a Mexican Restaurant on Oct. 1, 2019 at 1:12 p.m.
The shooting of Brandon took place on Oct. 2. The other receipt is from Chick-fil-A in Ammon on Oct. 18, 2019 at 8:05 p.m.
Tammy Daybell died the night of Oct. 18 until Oct. 19, Wright says. The receipt date was significant to law enforcement.
On Sept. 25, Alex visited Walmart in Idaho Falls and bought a cell phone with cash at 7:10 p.m. His other cell phone shows he was in the vicinity of the Walmart at this time, Wright says. On Oct. 8, Alex visited Walmart in Rexburg from 3:01 - 3:37 p.m.
After Alex and Lori abandoned their Rexburg apartments, the property managers found two cell phones in Alex's unit. The phones were turned over to police. Wright learned the phones were the ones purchased at the Walmart stores.
Blake moves to admit the Walmart phone receipts into evidence.
Thomas objects to having the receipts admitted but Boyce overrules the objection and lets them in.
On Sept. 30, Alex's device is at Lori's apartment. On Oct. 1 and 2, it stays in Alex's apartment the entire time. On Oct. 3, Alex's device is back in Lori's apartment for the first time since Sept. 30.
Data points from Alex's phone were recorded at the Unified Sportmen's Gun Club in Rexburg on Sept. 3. Then it went to Walmart and back to the club. There was another visit to the gun range on Sept. 26 and Sept. 27.
The device was also at the same gun range on Sept. 28 for 2.5 hours.
On Oct. 7, Alex visited multiple gun ranges, according to the data points. He also went to two gun ranges on Oct. 8. Remember - Tammy Daybell was shot at in her driveway on Oct. 9.
Alex also visited a gun range on Oct. 12, where he spent time around the 50-yard range. He went back on Oct. 13 and spent time at the rifle range and pistol range.
On Oct. 15, Alex went to the shooting range twice but between visits, he went to his apartment, Lori's apartment, Walmart and Chad Daybell's house.
That was the last time in October that Alex's device visited a gun range.
Wright says he was looking at gun range data because of gunman incident involving Tammy Daybell, the attempted shooting of Brandon and the fact a lot of guns and ammunition were found inside Lori's garage.
Wright says on Oct. 9, there were a series of data points associated to Alex's phone at Sportman's Warehouse in Ammon. Wright points out on the map where the data points were recorded inside the store.
Wright went to Sportsman's Warehouse and pulled all the receipts during the time period Alex was there. "One particular receipt caught my attention," he says.
There were around 60 receipts and most were paid with credit or debit cards. The one that caught Wright's attention was a cash receipt. There were five items on the receipt - including a pair of Frogg Togg rain pants.
The property manager at Alex's apartment had a pair of Frogg Togg pants in their possession. There was also a ski mask, soft drink and gloves on the receipt.
When Wright was investigating at the store, he learned a camo beanie listed on the receipt was no longer in stock but all of the other items were.
We now see photos on the screen showing the glove Alex purchased (not the exact glove but one that was in the store when Wright visited).
The glove has a mitten portion that you can pull over your fingers or you can keep off. If the mitten portion isn't folded over, you can use your fingers.
e now see an image of the three-hole ski mask Alex purchased (not the actual mask but the same one that was inside the store when Wright investigated).
Now we see the Frogg Togg pants that were purchased - again, not the actual pants but a pair that was inside the store when Wright visited.
Wright says a number of searches were conducted on the HomerJMaximus account on Oct. 9, 2019. One was "Frogg Togg sizing for pants."
On Oct. 9, Alex's device left Sportman's Warehouse at 4:12 p.m. and traveled north from Ammon to the vicinity of Chad's house. It didn't stop but drives by and continues onto Highway 20.
The driver turns around and drives past the Daybell residence again before for returning to Alex's apartment until 5:16 p.m. The device remains at the apartment until 11:28 a.m. the next day.
A map is shown on the big screen and Wright uses a laser pointer to show the spots where data points were recorded by Alex's phone the evening of Oct. 9.
A data point is recorded at a canal behind Chad's house. "The road is fairly narrow and there is no shoulder. I was looking for a possible location where this person could have gone or if there was a vehicle nearby where it might have parked.
There really was no place for a vehicle...but right here near this canal there's a little pull-off that would fit one vehicle."
Back to the cell phones Alex bought at Walmart. He bought one on Oct. 8 but it was not activated until Oct. 9 at 1:20 p.m. Ten messages were sent between this device and Chad Daybell between 7:13 p.m. - 10:30 p.m.
While Alex's other phone was recorded at staying at his apartment that entire night, the new phone was texting Chad.
The cell phone carrier did not keep the text messages and nothing was able to be traced from the new phone. Blake suggests we take a lunch break because she's at a good stopping point. We will be back in about an hour."

Slam dunk. Alex was the assassin in the attempted murder on Tammy. All his practice was for nought. Maybe the gun jammed. He narrowly missed in the Brandon attempt on the 2nd Oct. I wonder if they have matched the Brandon bullet to one of Alex's guns? Have not seen that in the testimony so far. Also, I wonder if they have the content of those texts from 7.14pm till 10.30pm from Chad's phone?
 
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So can I ask how do you picture it. If he is holding her arms he can't be choking her or putting something over her head at the same time. Did he get something over her and then hold her by the arms. so she couldn't tear it off? I don't like to think about it but I can't quite see how it was gone about....? Were there two, Alex and Chad and one held her down...?
Yes and why didn't she scream and Garth hear it and the struggles. Maybe she was drugged? Though I haven't heard about toxicology.
 
They all just basically said they were warriors. Each had some bad times and were saved by Jesus to become a warrior.

Boyce did not want the bit played where she mentions Joe Ryan apparently. Not sure why. I guess it is prejudicial?

This is what the judge said.
https://twitter.com/PrettyLiesAlibi
Pretty Lies & Alibis
@PrettyLiesAlibi
·
13h

Lindsey Blake says the defendant is barred from entering in her own statements. Judge Boyce says it depends on what the statements are #lorivallow
@LawCrimeNetwork
Yeah, all I can figure is it brings in Joe and his "death" which also was not found to be murder where Charles was.

I think it would open a new can of worms and where one would think the prosecution would love the evidence of Lori thinking murder was okay and allowed by the bible so to speak, it probably would create a real appeal basis yet again. They also probably did not prepare to try anything regarding this recording or anything relating to Joe.

It would have been interesting to have the jury learn about yet another dead husband but not worth the risk I suppose...?

I fail to see what those first 40 minutes or whatever it was gained a thing for the defense either. As you said, it really just showed a big bunch of nothing. That they all claimed experiences, were sn*wing people imo and they were "called" I guess. So what? Hardly any bombshell and it hardly is anything of any kind to make any ripple in this case is it?
 
Very good point.

First, how does she even know the time of the kids' deaths? Unless she was involved.

Second. Have LE given a TOD even? I don't think so. We only know the burial times AFAIK.
Other than the other activity showing likely time of death added to date or times last seen, I don't think they have any TOD other than logical conclusions. And those times place Alex with many data points at Lori's apartment for hours and her alibi is that she was home in her apartment as I've heard it. Uhm, yeah she places herself there when they died with her alibi if you ask me... Right?

JJ climbing on HER cupboards and knocking her statue over was in her apartment...

Tylee would have been with mom one would think and then she was gone with again Alex with data points in her apartment and also at a far longer and later night into morning hours than ever before, the only time he showed at Lori's place in such hours...
 
Yes and why didn't she scream and Garth hear it and the struggles. Maybe she was drugged? Though I haven't heard about toxicology.
Nothing was found I don't believe other than the drug she was prescribed that I forget the name of right now and I believe an anti-depressant.

I mean he could have held her arms and his forearm be across her throat with his weight bearing down on her or it could have even been while standing and from behind but lacking is any signs of bruising or injury to the neck. And I agree, why wouldn't she scream if all he had hold of were her arms. It's notable too that most bruising was to one arm far more than the other.

I just can't quite come up with the scenario. I guess she could have been asleep and he gagged her or something first and she came to fighting and then he grabbed her arms...? Put a bag over her head and secured it quickly and then she started fighting and he grabbed her arms...

I believe he bruised her arms no doubt in her death but if anyone has the scenario that makes sense in how overall I'd like to hear it...

OR yes, she screamed and if so, why didn't Garth hear?

If Garth and Emma are called to testify, I hope the prosecution knows to go at them as strongly as they would any witness. They aren't some withering delicate five year olds. No one in this case I don't think by either side has been treated in any nasty manner, I will say that. The questions are serious ones but no one has been viciously torn to shreds.

In the West case, many minor boys have just testified against their parents. In Stauch, the defendant's daughter who was present for a lot had to testify and she is younger than Garth or Emma. I think in West they told the truth to the best of their memory, the one having the best solid memory imo. In Stauch, I think she for the most part told the truth. Let's see what Garth and Emma do but they should be called if it adds anything or helps close questions (jury would believe or not believe depending on how honest they seemed and if it fit the facts). They are more necessary in Chad's trial I think but still, Lori is charged in it and the conspiracy re their mom and those triangle points and whether she knew, etc. comes back to it. Their meeting of her, if they were upset, how their dad and Lori acted, oh yeah, they should be called I think.

Tammy's SIL worried in the interview five months ago that Garth would possibly throw himself under the bus by lying for his dad or saying something that clearly isn't true when matched with facts and she was begging him not to do that imo by hoping he doesn't is more how she said it.

If they haven't, these "kids" need to wake up and smell the coffee for lack of a better way to put it before I've had my coffee this morning lol so best I can come up with at moment.

Also do we know who was all present in the home? Was it only Garth? I know Emma was on scene in short order. Who was actually living there and home at the time... All? Only Garth? Why? Garth is the oldest isn't he?
 
Yeah, all I can figure is it brings in Joe and his "death" which also was not found to be murder where Charles was.

I think it would open a new can of worms and where one would think the prosecution would love the evidence of Lori thinking murder was okay and allowed by the bible so to speak, it probably would create a real appeal basis yet again. They also probably did not prepare to try anything regarding this recording or anything relating to Joe.

It would have been interesting to have the jury learn about yet another dead husband but not worth the risk I suppose...?

I fail to see what those first 40 minutes or whatever it was gained a thing for the defense either. As you said, it really just showed a big bunch of nothing. That they all claimed experiences, were sn*wing people imo and they were "called" I guess. So what? Hardly any bombshell and it hardly is anything of any kind to make any ripple in this case is it?
What it does show is only one of these "warriors" is sitting in that courtroom, on trial for 3 murders.
 
What it does show is only one of these "warriors" is sitting in that courtroom, on trial for 3 murders.
True.

I don't know the 4th person, may have heard name in past but Mow I think and both of the men have gone silent and no one talks of any longer and they avoid interviews...

And we know Mel G was part of THE CIRCLE of Chad and Lori... I'm not so sure she is innocent and I definitely don't believe in her overall innocence and lack of knowledge regarding some things... True of the men who have "disappeared"....? Mow seemed pretty connected with the Chad and Lori group is what I recall hearing, seeing, sensing in the early days but it quickly became where he went off the radar in any news etc. on the case as if he was never a part...

Archibald was content it seems to just get in those 40 minutes of nothingness mostly imo. I guess we will see what he does with it... Maybe it was just a big nothing but made a big to do over it to make the jury wonder what more there was to it and WHY he put something in that seems irrelevant...

I'm curious to see what defense is going to do in this case... Archie wants to get some church stuff in clearly where it is like "taboo" in this trial...

In Stauch, I expected nothing much of a defense as they are claiming insanity so he never bothered much questioning witnesses too hard, etc., no reason, client is insane. And now defense doc has been up to a big failure apparently. Not surprised. But here in Daybell, I'm not sure what the defense plans on other than her alibi (which I think is blown and was a crock to begin with) and arguing in closing State hasn't proved her connection nor that she is guilty of murder. But I'm not sure... I don't see Lori or Archie just letting it just go without something up the sleeve for a defense...

What do you think?
 
True.

I don't know the 4th person, may have heard name in past but Mow I think and both of the men have gone silent and no one talks of any longer and they avoid interviews...

And we know Mel G was part of THE CIRCLE of Chad and Lori... I'm not so sure she is innocent and I definitely don't believe in her overall innocence and lack of knowledge regarding some things... True of the men who have "disappeared"....? Mow seemed pretty connected with the Chad and Lori group is what I recall hearing, seeing, sensing in the early days but it quickly became where he went off the radar in any news etc. on the case as if he was never a part...

Archibald was content it seems to just get in those 40 minutes of nothingness mostly imo. I guess we will see what he does with it... Maybe it was just a big nothing but made a big to do over it to make the jury wonder what more there was to it and WHY he put something in that seems irrelevant...

I'm curious to see what defense is going to do in this case... Archie wants to get some church stuff in clearly where it is like "taboo" in this trial...

In Stauch, I expected nothing much of a defense as they are claiming insanity so he never bothered much questioning witnesses too hard, etc., no reason, client is insane. And now defense doc has been up to a big failure apparently. Not surprised. But here in Daybell, I'm not sure what the defense plans on other than her alibi (which I think is blown and was a crock to begin with) and arguing in closing State hasn't proved her connection nor that she is guilty of murder. But I'm not sure... I don't see Lori or Archie just letting it just go without something up the sleeve for a defense...

What do you think?
I honestly don't know. I think the conspiracy charges will stick. Do you think Melanie G is guilty of murder? You said she isn't innocent?
 

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