LIBBY GERMAN & ABBY WILLIAMS: Indiana vs. Richard Allen for 2017 murder of two Delphi girls *TRIAL IN PROGRESS*

On February 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams and Liberty German were discovered near the Monon High Bridge Trail, which is part of the Delphi Historic Trails in Delphi, Indiana, United States, after the young girls had disappeared from the same trail the previous day. The murders have received significant media coverage because a photo and audio recording of an individual believed to be the girls' murderer was found on German's smartphone. Despite the audio and video recordings of the suspect that have been circulated and the more than 26,000 tips that police have received, no arrest in the case has been made.[1][2][3]



Police have not publicly stated nor released details of how the girls were murdered.[6] As early as February 15, 2017, Indiana State Police began circulating a still image of an individual reportedly seen on the Monon High Bridge Trail near where the two friends were slain; the grainy photograph appearing to capture a Caucasian male, with hands in pockets, walking on the rail bridge, head down, toward the girls.[4] A few days later, the person in the photograph was named the prime suspect in the double-homicide.[5]

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant,[7] though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." It was at this news conference that officials credited the source of the audio and imagery to German's smartphone, and, further, regarded her as a hero for having had the uncanny foresight and fortitude to record the exchange in secret. Police indicated that additional evidence from the phone had been secured, but that they did not release it so as not to "compromise any future trial." By this time, the reward offered in the case was set at $41,000.[5]

Murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On Feb 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams & Liberty German were discovered in Delphi, #INDIANA. The suspect in their deaths is awaiting trial.

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant, though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." Even with a lot of media coverage, their murders remain unsolved.

www.crimewatchers.net

 

[GrandmaBear]

Happy Solar Eclipse Eve.

4/7 Edited (thank u @Tresir for correcting motion name error)
Status notes:
These status notes are JMHO, based upon my own reading and interpretation of the docket. I have been able to read every docket entry and every filing and every exhibit and even the available 3/18 transcript ... (not on docket) .. at least once. (I think I've read them all, anyway!!) Corrections welcome!

- April 2nd - The Court has ruled on the March 18th Motion to Dismiss Hearing: Denied.

Upon closing that March 18th Motion to Dismiss Hearing, Gull directed that the Defense submit a Summary Memorandum, followed by a Prosecution Response to Memo - to be filed by week-apart deadlines following the March 18th hearing's afternoon session. (The afternoon's hearing session on 3/18 transcript - I have previously posted to this thread). Gull indicated at the 3/18 Motion to Dismiss Hearing that upon reviewing both the hearing, and these memo submissions, and exhibits, she would then take all under advisement in order to rule on this Motion to Dismiss, decision April 2nd.

- We still await the Court's Contempt hearing decision (from the March 18th morning session).

The P submitted a summary (and D answered) after the Contempt Hearing 3/18 as well; the Prosecution asked Gull for a non-specific "sanction" of her choosing, thereby dropping the original Contempt Motion ask for a 2nd removal of the D. It remains unclear (a technicality) as to what type of contempt the P understood they were bringing; the P asserts in their summary papers that the contempt was "unique" ... suggesting Gull can decide.

On this Contempt matter, any post-hearing memos have been filed and we're now about 10 days into a 30 day clock for the Court's ruling on that Contempt motion brought by the P.

- Additional discovery to be submitted by the P to the D has been listed (and requested) by the D - some of those requests for discovery remain outstanding. Several filings indicate that the D feels relevant discovery has not been shared with them. The same filings suggest the P is still "looking"/"searching"/"contacting" in its efforts to get outstanding discovery to the D.

- We await the Court's Decision on a 3rd Franks Hearing request from the Defense, filed 3/13/24. State has Responded, and D has Replied to State's Response. We should hear from the Court soon - whether a hearing will be granted or denied.


- One set of missing discovery includes crime scene "geotracking" discovery. The P has recently asserted (in their Response to the Defense's 3rd Franks Hearing Motion) that the "geotracking evidence" LE has collected is not useful to the D, and that b/c the D's are not geotracking experts they can't know if the geotracking report is useful, meaningful, exculpatory, or not. The D's Reply agrees that the D are not experts, so the D hired a geotracking expert to evaluate the P's geotracking discovery as provided, thus the D's further questions as to the investigation's geotracking expert reports on the P's geotracking.

- As to Health and Mental Health Records, RA and the D have released these to the P.

- There has recently been a Court decision not to penalize the Prosecutor for various missing, late and still outstanding discovery transfers to the Defense.

Additional discovery to be submitted by the P to the D has been listed (and formally requested) by the D - some of those requests for discovery remain outstanding. Several filings indicate that the D feels relevant discovery has not been shared with them. The same filings suggest the P is still "looking"/"searching"/"contacting" in its efforts to get outstanding discovery to the D.

IMO, it's reasonable (given past is prologue), to predict that Gull will (very shortly) deny the D's 3rd request for a Frank's Hearing.
IMO, Defense continues to make a deep appellate record via its pre-trial filings.

Ongoing: Discovery disclosure demands from the D upon the P, and Expert compensation requests from the D to the Court.
On deck: pre-trial motions/rules of evidence hearings
Rules of Evidence: I'm aware of no decisions from the Court to date as to evidence/experts/witnesses being ruled in or out for trial.

Please reference this case's docket, where filings, the Court's calendaring, and the Courts minute decisions are maintained for public access. The docket link has been posted in this thread. The 3/18 transcript is not on the docket but was previously attached in this thread.

MOO MOO

I'm not in a state where we will get a full eclipse and if it is as cloudy, gray and rainy and windy and cold as today, it likely won't be much of one. We are to have a 3/4 I think or thereabouts.

I will be at work and may even forget, however, others or customers may remind me however they may all be nonexistent and outside at home awaiting the eclipse. I bought my om a pair of eclipse glasses for her 80th lol just, the cheap ones for sale everywhere not as her main gift of course but a little fun stupid add on. I will expect her to report to me tomorrow since I have none and she has the real deal for glasses lol.

As for the rest, I'm not going to even counter to speak of other than the geofencing sh*t I have an entirely different take on.

I could say something about all else as well but don't feel the need, we've all been there already. I have seen summary of the prosecution follow up in the contempt hearing leaving it to Gull but also making it clear any sanction chosen should ensure this kind of thing STOPS happening/never happens again. Like the leaks for instance. Not to mention how who MW was and what he knew, did and distributed changed in their answers over time.

I dont' know that it's a deep appellate record but they sure can appeal after. I mean so much of that is allowed over almost anything these days and that will either overturn or confirm Gull's rulings, etc.

Take this as it's meant please and that's that you are as biased or colored as anyone here and more than some perhaps. This could be said to me and I'd take it and agree to a point but I'd probably not entirely agree lol. Most here are in one direction or another, perhaps not all the ones who say a bit but not a lot. And some more than others. And one who shall remain nameless has his entirely own take and direction lol.

Are you going to get a full eclipse? Do you have glasses? One woman told me this week they couldn't find any but the last one they ever watched someone told them to wear welding helmets lol and she said such worked great. I can just see the world out in their yards in welding helmets.

A light note. It could be used on occasion in this case.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Gull ruled already.

Link below.

Judge denies Delphi murder suspect's motion to dismiss the charges​

---

​

RON WILKINS Lafayette Journal & Courier

DELPHI, Ind. — Special Judge Frances Gull denied Delphi murder suspect Richard Allen's request to dismiss the charges because of destroyed recordings of possible suspects that might exonerate Allen.
Allen's attorneys argued the destroyed video recordings might contain evidence indicating someone other than Allen is the killer.
Steve Mullins, Delphi police chief at the time of the killings, testified during a March 18 hearing that the recorder mistakenly was left on, and recordings from Feb. 14 through Feb. 20, 2017, were lost after the drive's large memory was filled.
In her order published Tuesday, Gull wrote, "(T)he defendant has failed to show that the evidence was exculpatory and that it was destroyed negligently, intentionally, or in bad faith. The recordings of interviews between February 14-20, 2017 were lost due to human error or were spontaneously lost due to the equipment resetting."
Allen is charged with murder in the Feb. 13, 2017, killings of teenagers Libby German and Abby Williams, who were abducted off of the trails around the Monon High Bridge east of Delphi. Search parties found their bodies the morning of Feb. 14, 2017, on the north banks of Deer Creek about a quarter of a mile from the bridge.
More: What the new Delphi murder documents say about the crime scene, other suspects
Allen's attorneys have suggested in court filings that Libby and Abby's killings were part of an Odinist ritual sacrifice and two alleged Odinists were interviewed in the days after the girls' bodies were discovered.

Judge Frances Gull speaks at the Oct. 19 hearing of accused Delphi killer Richard Allen.
ENOS, JANE
In her order published Tuesday, Gull wrote, "As neither ... (men) were suspects at the time the interviews were conducted, the defendant has failed to show that the lost interview of (one of the men) ... was material and that the lack of a recorded interview of ... (the other man) was material. As defendant must establish materiality to claim a denial of due process and Allen had failed to do so, his due process rights have not been violated."
Gull also heard evidence on March 18 for and against holding Allen's attorneys — Brad Rozzi and Andrew Baldwin — in contempt, accusing them of violating a gag order by publishing a news release about the case the day before the order was signed Dec. 2, 2022. In the contempt hearing, Carroll County Prosecutor Nicholas McLeland also accused Rozzi and Baldwin of being responsible for leaked photos from the crime scene.
Gull has not yet ruled on the contempt allegations.
Allen's trial is scheduled to begin May 13 and run through the end of the month.
Jury selection will be in Fort Wayne.
After the Allen County residents are empaneled as jurors, the trial will move to Delphi, where the evidence will be presented and jurors will decide Allen's fate.
The court blocked off three weeks for the trial, including Memorial Day.

Just going to point out this is an order and legal ruling that gives the decision, the reasons and what legal filings should. An order from her is nothing like the one they proposed in their third FM thing that she sign as if she said it. Again it was ridiculous.

Simple to the point with the reasons.

The only other thing I'll point out is speedy trial was filed for by the defense and there is absolutely no problem going on with that by the judge or the prosecution, it is all being set and prepared with jury selection in Fort Wayne and so on. The calendar is set as is a calendar for all recent motions and follow up filings and decisions. I dont' see where there's any problem with most here in doing their jobs without fanfare and long diatribes unrelated to anything for sensationalism or to feel sorry for the underdogs who even knows sometimes. Let's remember these were the two willing to go pro Bono. Not that they are but they were willing. This post is general and not a response to anyone and it is under here because that is where the info is about the decision.

We will see in not long if this goes off on time and if it doesn't, we will see what details it, or whom.

Take a minute for A & L and their families. In all cases, I think that needs to be done sometimes, just stop and remember no matter what one believes what this all does to them and what happened to these two girls of theirs.

I have no time or will get no sleep and I am STILL going to watch Tom tonight and haven't gotten there yet. He is more unbiased than almost anyone here and I am including myself in that statement. It is why I watch, it helps check me. I don't always agree with him but for the most part I do.

 

[GrandmaBear]

RSBM

Thank you!! Ah ha! There she be:

View attachment 21800



Looks like we're waiting on the Contempt Decision ... and the 3rd Franks Hearing Decision.
My bad memory! Mixing the Franks on the docket as the Dismissal motion in my above post. I'll add the 3rd Franks in that post with an edit note.
(Edit is for me ... I check my notes here later. I've noted my edit ... credit Tresir)

Thanks again. This crazy case ... takes a village.
Back to real life; hope to see y'all closer to Trial time!

Short and to the point with the reasons. What one would expect from an officer of the court, attorney, etc.

Sit up and pay attention to how to do that B & R. When they have an occasional good point they destroy it imo by then going everywhere and off forever and ever. Like I would lol. However I'm not representing a man charged with a double murder. I don't see too many points but a few that aren't huge, but even if they could just hit on those and STOP they'd be far more effective. I'm just sayin'...

 

[GrandmaBear]

Well I wish I lived a life of leisure seriously as we have Daybell likely to go full steam ahead tomorrow, Karen Read's comes in I think sometime during that one for time frame and RA going in May...

Off to Tom.

 

[Olenna]

I'm not in a state where we will get a full eclipse and if it is as cloudy, gray and rainy and windy and cold as today, it likely won't be much of one. We are to have a 3/4 I think or thereabouts.

I will be at work and may even forget, however, others or customers may remind me however they may all be nonexistent and outside at home awaiting the eclipse. I bought my om a pair of eclipse glasses for her 80th lol just, the cheap ones for sale everywhere not as her main gift of course but a little fun stupid add on. I will expect her to report to me tomorrow since I have none and she has the real deal for glasses lol.

As for the rest, I'm not going to even counter to speak of other than the geofencing sh*t I have an entirely different take on.

I could say something about all else as well but don't feel the need, we've all been there already. I have seen summary of the prosecution follow up in the contempt hearing leaving it to Gull but also making it clear any sanction chosen should ensure this kind of thing STOPS happening/never happens again. Like the leaks for instance. Not to mention how who MW was and what he knew, did and distributed changed in their answers over time.

I dont' know that it's a deep appellate record but they sure can appeal after. I mean so much of that is allowed over almost anything these days and that will either overturn or confirm Gull's rulings, etc.

Take this as it's meant please and that's that you are as biased or colored as anyone here and more than some perhaps. This could be said to me and I'd take it and agree to a point but I'd probably not entirely agree lol. Most here are in one direction or another, perhaps not all the ones who say a bit but not a lot. And some more than others. And one who shall remain nameless has his entirely own take and direction lol.

Are you going to get a full eclipse? Do you have glasses? One woman told me this week they couldn't find any but the last one they ever watched someone told them to wear welding helmets lol and she said such worked great. I can just see the world out in their yards in welding helmets.

A light note. It could be used on occasion in this case.

Indeed a close-to-total eclipse here but our weather forecast is "cloudy". No rooms at our inns.
Family pack of glasses for a very tiny bit of money delivered same day from Amazon.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

They called the car a '65 Ford Focus I believe lol. Attention to detail fails them and is not their strong suit. So does it fail anyone who is their proofreader, or writer or if they are vice versa. It stood out to me immediately. That's what they said. Not their only error or falsehood.

Turco did not say what the defense states he did. He never said Os did this, he said someone trying to make it look as if they did to throw things off was the impression I had if I recall and because it was such a poor attempt to mimic runes an O would have known how to do or something on that order. Defense misconstrues or changes much. They also for some reason it seems have not interviewed Turco themselves or if they have, it sure isn't known.

I read the entire thing. You can tell Tresir to read it but you can't tell me because I did read the entire whole thing (a sheer waste of my limited time) and I found it lacking with no meat anywhere near worthy to be granted a Frank's hearing. They'd truly better get their wandering rambling ways under control before they are in front of a jury. I don't see how anyone can be impressed with the job they do either in written form or in arguing in a courtroom thus far.

The judge has denied/dismissed hasnt' she? They need to move on and use their time wisely once. Imo. They can always appeal this and probably anything they want after trial, God knows most all of them do.

I think this is a good spot to remind even if they could place an O there which they can't, it isn't a theory that removes their client, his bullet or anything else. They flat out state men by name did these murders but they can't put them there and it sounds like most have alibis. RA doesn't--his alibi is he WAS there and so WAS his bullet, car, etc. I mean what always remains is that inherent problem. They can argue it in court as an alternate theory if they wish but if I were the prosecution, I'd point these things out repeatedly and shoot it out of the water.

I'd also go back to there's a bigger desperation and perhaps it is why they keep at it to get rid of something we don't know about imo. They are very concerned about something and whatever it is is probably the same thing that had RA confessing.

Jmo.

BBM

I can't believe nobody making that noticed.

I noticed it immediately. Obviously they meant to say 60s Mercury.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

Indeed a close-to-total eclipse here but our weather forecast is "cloudy". No rooms at our inns.
Family pack of glasses for a very tiny bit of money delivered same day from Amazon.

You're not in Rochester?

 

[Cousin Dupree]

FOX59 exclusive: Attorney for Delphi defense team puzzled by court and prosecutor blow back

INDIANAPOLIS — Special Judge Fran Gull in the Delphi double murder trial has issued a Gag Order to prohibit the State and the Defense and investigators from talking to the media about the case agai…

fox59.com

From the article:

"Within two weeks of their assignment in November 2022, and reacting to multiple media requests for comment, Baldwin and Rozzi issued a three-page press release dismantling the State’s investigation.


Shortly thereafter, Judge Gull issued the Gag Order the defense attorneys are accused of violating.


Hennessy said that, upon review, the attorneys were late to game following more than five years of public comment on the case by investigators and a prior Carroll County prosecutor.


“The state-sponsored media presence over the years, over 138 (contacts), and the defense lawyers had one press conference (sic) but there was not a gag order, so that can’t be Contempt, in my opinion, because it didn’t violate an order.'"


________________________________________________

"Also denied this past week was a Defense attempt to drop the charges against Allen, claiming that Exculpatory Evidence essential to their client’s case — video recordings of other persons mentioned as having potential knowledge of the case — were erased in 2017, but the destruction was unknown until last year.


“The recordings of interviews between Feb. 14-20, 2017, were lost due to human error or were spontaneously lost due to equipment resetting,” wrote the judge who found that the interviewees were not, “suspects at the time the interviews were conducted (and as such), the defendant has failed to show that the (evidence) was material.”


Hennessy said the irony of the Contempt Complaint against his clients for allegedly mishandling evidence while at the same time the exoneration of State investigators for deleting or causing evidence to be destroyed is not lost on him.


”I think the similarities of what you’ve just described speak for themselves,” Hennessy said. “And the discrepancy is apparent.'"

 

[Tresir]

Judge Gull is obviously doing everything she can to sabotage the defenses efforts. Everything pointing to RA's innocence is a nothing burger to her. She won't even provide funding for some of their efforts.

They cannot keep getting endless funding for experts till they finally get one who says what they want. If they have already had funding for a particular type of expert, eg Viking symbolism then that's it surely, I would think. We know they got MH experts already, I think don't we? Or I am speculating they have done so. I seem to remember something about the P seeing the MH expert requests when they shouldn't have done.

 

[Tresir]

I will be so glad when this trial finally begins and all this BS ends. I really don't care about the contempt issue. They will probably just get a slap on the wrist and a fine and just go and do it again. They didn't just "mishandle evidence". They broke a gag order by describing the CS and leaking CS photos. And I think they did it knowingly, not by accident. They are very lucky to still to be on the case. This is what we used to call a "doggie chance" when we played cards years ago - one below the last chance, where you only get dealt one card but can use it when you want.

 

[GrandmaBear]

They cannot keep getting endless funding for experts till they finally get one who says what they want. If they have already had funding for a particular type of expert, eg Viking symbolism then that's it surely, I would think. We know they got MH experts already, I think don't we? Or I am speculating they have done so. I seem to remember something about the P seeing the MH expert requests when they shouldn't have done.

They have been paid for experts. They fail to support the need for more and so on. Few mention that some were approved and payt was issued, rather they'd have one believe Gull denied any and all.

 

[Tresir]

This is an article about the death of the second officer, ISP Sergeant Stephanie Thompson, who died in an early morning house fire on 17th Feb 2022 along with her daughter Mya.

Grief-filled vigil held for ISP sergeant, daughter killed in Monticello house fire

Monticello community came together Sunday in a vigil for mother, daughter killed in a house fire last week.

www.jconline.com

Cause of fire was undetermined.

Cause of fire that killed Monticello mother, daughter in February ruled undetermined

Mya Thompson and her mother Trooper Stephanie Thompson died on February 17 after a fire fully engulfed their home in the 3200 block of North Lakeshore Drive.

www.wrtv.com

So the two cops from this investigation died in July '21 and Feb 2022, long before RA was identified as a suspect.

 

[Tresir]

State's response to defendant's motion to dismiss in MW case.

I do not think this has been posted yet.

 

[Tresir]

States response to defendants FM3 motion.

 

[Tresir]

I saw that MW's wife filed for divorce in December. I guess she wasn't too happy with B saying MW often called into the office when he was visiting his GF.

 

[Tresir]

So the defence got the geofence report but they don't understand it and
now need a geofence expert to help them interpret it. So how can they say that RA's phone is not near the CS if they don't understand it?

 

[Tresir]

They have upped the target on the Payit to $45k now since they exceeded the $25k initial goal.

They have now raised $30k of that new target.

Experts for Richard Allen

This is the official expert expense fund for Richard Allen. Richard Allen was once employed as a licensed pharmacy technician at the CVS in Delphi, IN.&nbs

www.payit2.com

 

[Imamazed]

Delphi defense team once again accuses police investigators of lying, omitting details

CARROLL COUNTY, Ind. — The attorneys for accused Delphi killer Richard Allen are once again claiming that police investigators lied or deceived a judge in filing for a search warrant that led…

fox59.com

 

[GrandmaBear]

Indeed a close-to-total eclipse here but our weather forecast is "cloudy". No rooms at our inns.
Family pack of glasses for a very tiny bit of money delivered same day from Amazon.

We sold glasses for over a month and in the week before put them on sale (for a negligible amount) and had tons and two days before ran out of them and we had had tons for a couple of months lol. Everyone the day or two before was coming as they were on sale but they were all gone. Sold out. We weren't in the total path for states but our forecast was cloudy in the days leading up as I asked my mom about where she lives and was looking the same and she is the one I got a pair for when we had them.

Haven't talked to her today but worked and yes we had an entirely cloudy day. As far as I ever saw. People were mentioning it, customers and such, about if one would notice or be able to see anything and so on. A cashier I talked to thought we were to be at one but I had read two and she was talking to a customer about it.

Anyhow never saw anyhing get darker or anything which one would maybe think it would behind the clouds when the sun was covered or mostly so. At any time but we were full clouds etc. all day anyhow.

Lo and behold though I had a customter after two who asked if anyone had seen it and he had been in our parking lot in back, not where I could see, at the right time, and lol and behold he said total cloud cover and a cloud moved and he had a pic on his phone that was pretty darned good for our day and the fact it was a cell phone pic of the sky! I told a few coworkers nearby and we all ooohed and ahhhhed. It entirely showed it. Not some close up but it showed the sun 3/4 or more covered. And again not in a blue sky.

So that was my experience. Other than that guy, lol, not a word about anyone who saw it.

I did talk to another employee who had customers a few days ago that were actually traveling to SEE what we weren't tog etc as to full coverage. She said a few families; and people she talked to were planning on it and kind of shook her head lol. I asked where that would be and she said Arkansas most were headed to and said can you imagine you make a trip and if cloudy and can't see it lol. I said yeah, lots cheaper to buy a two buck pair of glasses than gas, hotel rooms, etc. and be disappointed. We laughed. The icing on it was getting to work today before it and there's a sign up that no refunds (and we are very easy with refunds, VERY) are to be given for eclipse glasses lol per the GM. I don't doubt someone would try to get a buck back. Or two if they bought at full price. LOL.

So what was your experience?? Haven't asked my mom yet. Guessing she didn't see one. Also the guy who got the pic had no glasses and didn't need any lol.

O/T I know but that can be necessary in here with all the opinions including my own strong ones

 

[GrandmaBear]

BBM

I can't believe nobody making that noticed.

I noticed it immediately. Obviously they meant to say 60s Mercury.

Obviously but at least you agree with the lack of attention to detail. Not a deal breaker case winner or breaker but for me it is just their whole lack of professionalism and these days, one needs to ensure their legal filings are up to par. On all sides. Judges need to as well. With orders, etc.

But lol I'm no car expert but as you, I noticed right off. I do KNOW there were no Ford Focuses in the 60s. And if I am any kind of buff or know more on some than others, it is with Fords.

It's also proof I read it lol.