OH BRAYLEN NOBLE: Missing from Toledo, OH - 4 Sept 2020 - Age 3 *Found Deceased*

Police, firefighters searching Swan Creek near Byrne Road for missing 3-year-old

Toledo Police and Fire & Rescue crews are searching for a 3-year-old boy who went missing at Friday afternoon at Hunter's Ridge Apartments. According to police, Braylen's mother suspects he fell out of a third-story window. After searching the adjacent Swan Creek, a nearby swimming pool and...

nbc24.com

Police, firefighters searching Swan Creek near Byrne Road for missing 3-year-old

Toledo Police and Fire & Rescue crews are searching for a 3-year-old boy who went missing at Friday afternoon at Hunter's Ridge Apartments.

According to police, Braylen's mother suspects he fell out of a third-story window.

Crews including divers and K-9 are currently searching in the woods and creek nearby.

TPD: Body found in Hunters Ridge apartment pool, believed to be missing 3-year-old Braylen Noble

Official confirmation and identification will come from the Lucas County Coroner's Office, TPD said. Braylen Noble was reported missing in a 911 call placed Sept. 4.

www.wtol.com

TPD, Toledo Fire searching for missing nonverbal 3-year-old

Toledo Police and Fire are searching for a missing 3-year-old boy this afternoon and also are asking for the public's help in locating the missing toddler in south Toledo.
Braylen Noble, 3, was reported missing on Friday from the 3400 block of Gibraltar Heights Drive at the Hunters Ridge apartments. His mother called police to say the boy apparently fell out of a third-floor window and she couldn't find him, police said.

The child last was seen wearing a long-sleeved red and white Mickey Mouse shirt.

Toledo Police and Fire personnel have been searching for the boy since 12:25 p.m. Friday.

Braylen is nonverbal, police said. Toledo Police and Fire personnel are searching the areas of South Byrne Road and Airport Highway, and the area by the apartment complex in the 3400 block of Gibraltar Heights Drive.

Officers and detectives are now conducting door-to-door searches of the entire apartment complex, police said at 2:42 p.m.

Also assisting police and fire personnel with the search are Toledo Metroparks Officers. Teams are conducting an area search of surrounding buildings, dumpsters, under vehicles and more, police say.

Drones have been deployed to assist the search and Toledo Fire and Rescue Department's water rescue unit is also on Swan Creek to help search. K9 units are also being employed to help search.

Police say the child's mother has been taken to the Safety Building as a matter of protocol in such search situations.


MEDIA - BRAYLEN NOBLE: Missing from Toledo, OH since 4 Sept 2020 - Age 3

 

[GrandmaBear]

All of those questions would have been answered if they would have simply drained the pool. I can't understand why that wasn't done. It wasn't functioning so there was absolutely no good reason not to.

Yeah, the entire thing was "fraught" with issues and hard to understand things of why this was done and why that wasn't, etc. This case will always stand out to me.

I was trying to remember but it also wasn't very full was it? As you said too, it wasn't even functional.

 

[Guess Who]

Yeah, the entire thing was "fraught" with issues and hard to understand things of why this was done and why that wasn't, etc. This case will always stand out to me.

I was trying to remember but it also wasn't very full was it? As you said too, it wasn't even functional.

It wasn't full. It appeared to have been lowered as the standard lowering for off season. If you are in an area that has a high water table, you can't totally drain an inground pool. If the water table rises above the bottom of the deepest part, it can dislodge the entire pool and "float" it like a boat which will break any plumbing and possibly even the pool itself. They have to have the weight in them to keep them down and in place. It still wouldn't have hurt at all to drain it for that. All you have to do is put some more in it afterwards and even if it was the pump that was the issue, the fire departments have pumps that would do that for them. It's standard gear here since they often need to pump basements after fires from putting so much water on the fire.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Exactly, I'm bothered that it comes across as bias...
Since the coroner's office was undecided, I'm curious to know whether they subsequently sought outside consultation because if they didn't, then I think they certainly should have, and I'd wonder why they didn't.

All I've been able to ascertain about the search of the pool is that it was searched that first day, and then after the discovery/recovery, LE stated that they had gone back to search it again.

For the first part, I'm not sure but we really wondered about LE I know that... Never want to jump to conclusions but some cases it is hard not to and many on this case I think had to wonder. I do recall that when they found him it was almost like it was over and done with and then we all waited for the autopsy but they seemed like well he drowned even before that and it seemed "case closed". I'm not even sure autopsy didn't have to be pushed for beyond the local ME or if there was one that went further than the local county/pd/etc. And then those with doubts were waiting and it seemed they were NEVER going to get or tell us autopsy results, wanted it to just disappear and those who doubted stayed or tried to vocal online etc and we finally got it and I thought it was like okay, he drowned and case closed again.... And again tried to remember the case and stay vocal and then a long time and these charges came but I do wonder if they would have if some hadn't been satisfied and tried to keep the case alive and questions. I don't know. And this is to the best of my recollection. I remember a lot very well but the fine details not quite so much.

On your second paragraph, over the days I believe even residents looked in the pool. I think the pool was walked and not just divers, etc. I jut remember knowing that over that week residents looked and maybe even went in, cops did, divers did, people stood by it and discussed the case and more.

Kind of aside from all of that, much discussion also about of course about how unlikely this child feel from an apartment window, I guess popped right up on the ground and then ran for the pool that was gated and locked. So it also comes back to the mother/gma were not telling the truth or are we to believe that?

I realize I'm not putting things real clearly but I need to reread the case but I don't think they sent "out" for a major autopsy by someone else if I recall? I think they sent tox out and such but that's not the same.

 

[GrandmaBear]

I don't know whether there would have been access on that Friday.

Residents have keys if that is what you mean. So his mother would have a key. Etc. The child wouldn't have. Or do you mean locking down the area as to LE?

 

[GrandmaBear]

It wasn't full. It appeared to have been lowered as the standard lowering for off season. If you are in an area that has a high water table, you can't totally drain an inground pool. If the water table rises above the bottom of the deepest part, it can dislodge the entire pool and "float" it like a boat which will break any plumbing and possibly even the pool itself. They have to have the weight in them to keep them down and in place. It still wouldn't have hurt at all to drain it for that. All you have to do is put some more in it afterwards and even if it was the pump that was the issue, the fire departments have pumps that would do that for them. It's standard gear here since they often need to pump basements after fires from putting so much water on the fire.

I didn't think so, it seemed it had a couple of feet at best. I know we discussed before but ours gets drained and covered. To me, whether he was seen or not in the pool isn't entirely it as the surrounding facts and stories over that week and then finding him there after all of that just come together for a conclusion that he wasn't there. He was moved to there. Most likely.

 

[Guess Who]

I didn't think so, it seemed it had a couple of feet at best. I know we discussed before but ours gets drained and covered. To me, whether he was seen or not in the pool isn't entirely it as the surrounding facts and stories over that week and then finding him there after all of that just come together for a conclusion that he wasn't there. He was moved to there. Most likely.

The shallow end had at least a foot in it and I don't know if we ever knew how deep the deep end is, if it has one. That could be still quite deep. I just wish they would have drained it instead of sending multiple people in it. This all would have been answered if they did.

 

[GrandmaBear]

The shallow end had at least a foot in it and I don't know if we ever knew how deep the deep end is, if it has one. That could be still quite deep. I just wish they would have drained it instead of sending multiple people in it. This all would have been answered if they did.

And it begs the question of why they didn't. Not doing so now of course lends to they can't say he wasn't there... Well they can try but draining it would have been a sure thing...

 

[Regina]

On your second paragraph, over the days I believe even residents looked in the pool. I think the pool was walked and not just divers, etc. I jut remember knowing that over that week residents looked and maybe even went in, cops did, divers did, people stood by it and discussed the case and more.

I've just been able to establish that there was a diver in the pool on that first day, and if the body was submerged, then merely searching "in the area" of the pool- which is what I've heard/read repeatedly as how such search was described, even from police- obviously wouldn't have been sufficient.

Kind of aside from all of that, much discussion also about of course about how unlikely this child feel from an apartment window, I guess popped right up on the ground and then ran for the pool that was gated and locked.

Well, I wish I could say how likely/unlikely I think it is, but I can't because there are facts and circumstances I just don't know (yet, lol).
Let's start with the pool area: Is it an established fact that the gate was locked? Is it even possible to establish that as a fact?

Residents have keys if that is what you mean. So his mother would have a key. Etc. The child wouldn't have. Or do you mean locking down the area as to LE?

I don't remember what I said (lol) but I'm sure I was thinking along the lines of whether there was any way at all that he alone could have had access to the pool area.

I didn't think so, it seemed it had a couple of feet at best. I know we discussed before but ours gets drained and covered. To me, whether he was seen or not in the pool isn't entirely it as the surrounding facts and stories over that week and then finding him there after all of that just come together for a conclusion that he wasn't there. He was moved to there. Most likely.

There's video of the diver where he appears to be standing and the water level appears chest high.
You know, it's weird because sometimes the pool looks rather small, but with the diver in it, it looks rather large. (Maybe it was a short, tiny diver, lol!)

And it begs the question of why they didn't. Not doing so now of course lends to they can't say he wasn't there... Well they can try but draining it would have been a sure thing...

I don't know how they could even try to say he wasn't always there because the way it unfolded is the way drownings usually unfold. What I mean is, the body sinks and surfaces days later. (I have to say, though, I'm not positive that the body was found floating, although I strongly suspect that it was.)

 

[GrandmaBear]

I've just been able to establish that there was a diver in the pool on that first day, and if the body was submerged, then merely searching "in the area" of the pool- which is what I've heard/read repeatedly as how such search was described, even from police- obviously wouldn't have been sufficient.


Well, I wish I could say how likely/unlikely I think it is, but I can't because there are facts and circumstances I just don't know (yet, lol).
Let's start with the pool area: Is it an established fact that the gate was locked? Is it even possible to establish that as a fact?

I don't remember what I said (lol) but I'm sure I was thinking along the lines of whether there was any way at all that he alone could have had access to the pool area.

There's video of the diver where he appears to be standing and the water level appears chest high.
You know, it's weird because sometimes the pool looks rather small, but with the diver in it, it looks rather large. (Maybe it was a short, tiny diver, lol!)

I don't know how they could even try to say he wasn't always there because the way it unfolded is the way drownings usually unfold. What I mean is, the body sinks and surfaces days later. (I have to say, though, I'm not positive that the body was found floating, although I strongly suspect that it was.)

The easy response to all of this is that you have and are running into the very same questions I think most of us have.

Watching it as it unfolded and wanting news is different than reading now as in all cases. I get and agree with most of your comments here but some we don't have answers to.

Theoretically I guess, I have a key to the door that leads to our pool in an apartment complex. Ours is from the inside though and enters out into a fenced area. NO ONE has access to the outside gate except management and maybe maintenance. In some cases in my building, people will keep an entry door propped open or maybe the hot tub room, but the pool is much harder to do that with AND if someone did, it wouldn't be for long before management would find it and shut it. I would say it is pretty good and it doesn't go on too long if someone does that but the entrance doors to the building are probably the most I see it... Someone has three loads of groceries to go back and forth to the car with, hands full, so they prop the door. I have never ever seen since fenced the pool able to be accessed but for a resident adult with a key. BUT places differ I'm sure.

I don't know but I am guessing the pics are angles that make the pool look one way or another. I know that rendering even in the gym mat case of the mats look far shorter to me than the purported height. Also in some cases when people are just trying to research, we will get shots of I think this is the playground or pool at this complex for instance before we have real pics from LE, etc.

Any which way we look at it though, if this child somehow drowned in the pool, then the mother/gma likely lied about falling out of an upper level window. If someone had a gate open to the pool, I will get you it was so they could come back in in a moment after running for something. I do not believe this 3 year old just found an unlocked gate to an unused pool and why would anyone leave it open when it was not open for use?

So again, the surrounding facts play in. If this child did indeed drown in THAT pool, then to me someone submerged and drowned him. I don't believe he did drown in the pool. He would have had to get in, unnoticed, after falling and being fine through a likely locked gate. I vaguely recalled debate on whether he could fit through the slats between metal fence "posts" or "slats" as well.

Emphasis just on case, and points, not directed at you. Yeah, it is just a case with a whole lot of questions. One that one can't quite say, sure, of course, we might not have all answers but that is probably what happened. Not in this case. Many of the things you wonder I believe are still wondered by many and we don't have answers to. And may never. That is why maybe info that comes out in the charges that are filed one can hope will tell more.

At minimum, the very minimum, the gma and mom lied and said he fell from the window to make it look as though they weren't negligent and he never got out of the apartment. That would be the best case scenario but I don't believe it.

Anyhow or anywho and so forth, there is a reason this one lingers...

 

[Regina]

Theoretically I guess, I have a key to the door that leads to our pool in an apartment complex. Ours is from the inside though and enters out into a fenced area. NO ONE has access to the outside gate except management and maybe maintenance.

I don't know if these residents had individual access to a locked gate...
All I've been able to see (from news video) is that the gate has a deadbolt, which causes me to consider that perhaps residents didn't have access outside of pool hours, in other words, that the pool was locked/unlocked daily by maintenance.

 

[GrandmaBear]

I don't know if these residents had individual access to a locked gate...
All I've been able to see (from news video) is that the gate has a deadbolt, which causes me to consider that perhaps residents didn't have access outside of pool hours, in other words, that the pool was locked/unlocked daily by maintenance.

I maybe didn't post it but in looking something up just a few days ago, an article said residents had keys and access to the pool. That is like ours but with ours there is no access for residents on the fenced outside portion, however, we an enter the pool area from the building BUT we need a key to the room the pool door is off of and that room's door can be locked by management (two locks) and is locked like after what time of night, etc.

Now therir pool is not adjoining to the building it doesn't look like but the article did say the residents have keys. However, since it was not in service, it could have well been double locked by maintenance but I wouldn't count on it as this was early September and many people will still sit at pool chairs and tables yet...

I guess to me the child did not enter the pool area with a key, he was 3. So if he was found there, a resident most likely was with him or put him there... And since I don't even believe he probably left the apartment on his own and certainly did not fall from a window and then go running off to the pool, well I think in my case it is logical to conclude there was an adult with a key involved at some point...

 

[Regina]

Now therir pool is not adjoining to the building it doesn't look like but the article did say the residents have keys. However, since it was not in service, it could have well been double locked by maintenance but I wouldn't count on it as this was early September and many people will still sit at pool chairs and tables yet...

I don't think I've come across info regarding pool keys...if I have, it didn't register, lol!
But that's also crossed my mind, I mean, the idea that residents may have been allowed access to the area despite the status of the pool...

 

[GrandmaBear]

I don't think I've come across info regarding pool keys...if I have, it didn't register, lol!
But that's also crossed my mind, I mean, the idea that residents may have been allowed access to the area despite the status of the pool...

I still imagine though it is likely only certain hours. I don't think ours is likely even accessible in the winter (haven't checked really, why...) It isn't shoveled or anything, I know that so I'm pretty sure the door from the inside into that outside area is locked. Also, it would only be to sit at tables and chairs in spring and fall. I'd have to look back at the pics in this case but if there were no tables and chairs up and if the chaise lounges were stacked or had no cushions, then I believe it would have been locked. On top of it our pool gets drained and covered or I will guarantee you no one would be able to access an uncared for pool that is not up and running and I believe that is how this one was, wasn't it? Gross water and not operational and no cover?

 

[Guess Who]

I still imagine though it is likely only certain hours. I don't think ours is likely even accessible in the winter (haven't checked really, why...) It isn't shoveled or anything, I know that so I'm pretty sure the door from the inside into that outside area is locked. Also, it would only be to sit at tables and chairs in spring and fall. I'd have to look back at the pics in this case but if there were no tables and chairs up and if the chaise lounges were stacked or had no cushions, then I believe it would have been locked. On top of it our pool gets drained and covered or I will guarantee you no one would be able to access an uncared for pool that is not up and running and I believe that is how this one was, wasn't it? Gross water and not operational and no cover?

Non operational should definitely have been covered since it seems it wasn't going to operate for the rest of the year. Many places can not drain them due to water tables.

 

[Guess Who]

It is not advised to leave a pool empty for extended periods: Depending on the level of the water shelf, sustained pressure on an in-ground pool without water can cause external damage. Additionally, a drained above-ground pool can receive structural damage from the elements.

How Long Can You Leave Your Pool Empty? | Easy Clear Pool

It can be straightforward maintaining a swimming pool while in use over the summer. However, once the season is over and it is too cold…

easyclearpool.com

 

[GrandmaBear]

Non operational should definitely have been covered since it seems it wasn't going to operate for the rest of the year. Many places can not drain them due to water tables.

Yeah and that just looked like a pool area to me and pool that they wouldn't have wanted anyone in the fenced area for any reason because of the pool... Pretty unkempt and unused looking if I recall.

 

[Guess Who]

Yeah and that just looked like a pool area to me and pool that they wouldn't have wanted anyone in the fenced area for any reason because of the pool... Pretty unkempt and unused looking if I recall.

The pool was non functional, but I don't remember the reasoning. It hadn't been functional for a bit before this, too. No reason why not to put the winter cover over it since it's season was going to be over that year.

 

[GrandmaBear]

The pool was non functional, but I don't remember the reasoning. It hadn't been functional for a bit before this, too. No reason why not to put the winter cover over it since it's season was going to be over that year.

Yeah that was the big Covid shutdown year, not sure if that was part of it or the pool had problems. Here is an article of different states, it shows Ohio opening pools (not specifically apartment pools, probably more the public ones) in late May. However, didn't we go into shutdown again plus many places probably didn't open at all or used it as an excuse... Apartments may have had their own rules or been governed in each state, and then as we know one county in a state may adopt different rules as probably could an apartment complex. I don't remember the actual reason in this case.

It does seem though it would have been locked and most likely even to residents... Imo. And as you say season was over, they weren't going to get it up and going now in September when this occurred...

 

[Regina]

I still imagine though it is likely only certain hours. I don't think ours is likely even accessible in the winter (haven't checked really, why...) It isn't shoveled or anything, I know that so I'm pretty sure the door from the inside into that outside area is locked. Also, it would only be to sit at tables and chairs in spring and fall. I'd have to look back at the pics in this case but if there were no tables and chairs up and if the chaise lounges were stacked or had no cushions, then I believe it would have been locked. On top of it our pool gets drained and covered or I will guarantee you no one would be able to access an uncared for pool that is not up and running and I believe that is how this one was, wasn't it? Gross water and not operational and no cover?

There were lots of lounge chairs in the area and a table with chairs around it...
Anyway, my line of thinking is that- for some reason- the gate wasn't shut all the way.

 

[GrandmaBear]

There were lots of lounge chairs in the area and a table with chairs around it...
Anyway, my line of thinking is that- for some reason- the gate wasn't shut all the way.

So you are thinking he did fall out of the window, get up uninjured and ran to the pool area, where the gate wasn't shut, and was in the pool the entire number of days the search went on?