Epstein, Maxwell et al: exposed in child sex trafficking

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Do we have a Jefferey Epstein thread?

 
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The probation department which I am guessing is like the presentence investigation recommends 20. Prosecutors are asking for min. 30. Apparently the defense 5 or 10 (say what?? of course it is the defense so no surprise there I guess).

She may be a first time charged offender but the very charges she was convicted of spanned many years and imo make her almost a career criminal. They are also serious charges and one alone carries a max of a possible 40 years. I think she will receive 20 to 25. and certainly deserves at least that and I think she deserrves more. Judge's often go with the presentence investigation recommendation but they don't have to. Often they go harsher and on rare occasion may go lighter. These investigations/probation dept. recommendations are done for a reason. Recommending sentencing is their job and what they are used by judges for.

There sure are a lot of people in this huge trafficking ring that are not getting what they deserve, not even the notoriety they deserve.

All jmo.
 
The probation department which I am guessing is like the presentence investigation recommends 20. Prosecutors are asking for min. 30. Apparently the defense 5 or 10 (say what?? of course it is the defense so no surprise there I guess).

She may be a first time charged offender but the very charges she was convicted of spanned many years and imo make her almost a career criminal. They are also serious charges and one alone carries a max of a possible 40 years. I think she will receive 20 to 25. and certainly deserves at least that and I think she deserrves more. Judge's often go with the presentence investigation recommendation but they don't have to. Often they go harsher and on rare occasion may go lighter. These investigations/probation dept. recommendations are done for a reason. Recommending sentencing is their job and what they are used by judges for.

There sure are a lot of people in this huge trafficking ring that are not getting what they deserve, not even the notoriety they deserve.

All jmo.
i see the 5-10 happening only as a plea deal for turning evidence. Hopefully.
 
i see the 5-10 happening only as a plea deal for turning evidence. Hopefully.
I don't know, it is well after the fact, her guilt is established/convicted, and sentencing is imminent with no sign of such. 5 to 10 is a slap on the wrist and I don't think without something big offered like you say a judge will go that light but jmo. Not an honest judge anyhow which no reason to believe she's not.
 
I don't know, it is well after the fact, her guilt is established/convicted, and sentencing is imminent with no sign of such. 5 to 10 is a slap on the wrist and I don't think without something big offered like you say a judge will go that light but jmo. Not an honest judge anyhow which no reason to believe she's not.
I'm sure not hoping for 5-10 for her, just that IF that is what she got it would be only because she forked over some MAJOR info. She deserves far more.
 
I'm sure not hoping for 5-10 for her, just that IF that is what she got it would be only because she forked over some MAJOR info. She deserves far more.
Oh I knew you weren't hoping that. but just that she gave up others, etc. I think she is going to see a couple of decades minimum. A light one would be 15 imo.
 
The defence makes their case well, I think. (What I read of it, that is). There is also the appeal too, of course. When you see the reach that Epstein had and also the apparent hold over people, it will not surprise me at all if there is more to come out.

The below is a federal sex trafficking case of a minor. The female sex trafficker received a 6.5 year sentence.

 
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The defence makes their case well, I think. (What I read of it, that is). There is also the appeal too, of course. When you see the reach that Epstein had and also the apparent hold over people, it will not surprise me at all if there is more to come out.

The below is a federal sex trafficking case of a minor. The female sex trafficker received a 6.5 year sentence.

Fatima pled guilty. Also many of the men pled guilty. That's a totally different ball of wax. The admitted guilt.
 
Fatima pled guilty. Also many of the men pled guilty. That's a totally different ball of wax. The admitted guilt.
I realise that. Can you find a similar federal sex trafficking conviction of a woman accomplice, first offence, as a comparison, because I have not found one so far. All I have found have been men and included violence, so not much to compare. Also, we would not necessarily know if she had agreed to anything eg she gave up her objection to the naming of the 8 John Does and they still have not named them. Also, the other female accomplices have got off Scot free so far it seems. The federal case above with a woman defendant still involved a minor plus violence so the minimum should still apply there, imo.
 
I realise that. Can you find a similar federal sex trafficking conviction of a woman accomplice, first offence, as a comparison, because I have not found one so far. All I have found have been men and included violence, so not much to compare. Also, we would not necessarily know if she had agreed to anything eg she gave up her objection to the naming of the 8 John Does and they still have not named them. Also, the other female accomplices have got off Scot free so far it seems. The federal case above with a woman defendant still involved a minor plus violence so the minimum should still apply there, imo.
No, I don't doubt there are some out there but searching them on that criteria is difficult, federally even more so imo. Like you say even in the case you cited it is difficult to know if they maybe provided information against others, had any kind of deal, etc. either--the men too.

In fact I don't know why federal cases don't make bigger news and our news really doesn't cover a TON of them. I used to go to the DOJ website and look routinely myself but got away from it when life got a bit busy with things I had to address. I'd like to get back to it one day. A LOT goes on in this nation that is hardly heard of and a lot of prosecutions when people think things aren't being cracked down on in the past many years, they need to really go look at some of the cases federally. In some administrations it is a lot more crack down than in others too...

Reading up on cases there too is also a great "teacher" for what is federal or what will be charged federally, which kinds of cases, etc... I knew of a lot but not all...
 
Her sentencing is in June isn't it? It must be imminent then--this week? Not long to wait to see what the judge gives her...
 
Her sentencing is in June isn't it? It must be imminent then--this week? Not long to wait to see what the judge gives her...
The 28th. So on Tuesday. She could get anywhere between 5 and 20 years IMO. If she has cooperated, we may not know about it. I did read she was tutoring in the prison for GED in one of the articles, don't know if that is true or not.
 
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The 28th. So on Tuesday. She could get anywhere between 5 and 20 years IMO. If she has cooperated, we may not know about it. I did read she was tutoring in the prison for GED in one of the articles, don't know of that is true or not.
Maybe that is felt likely I guess but I don't know how people think they know... I mean news people and pundits and experts etc. That judge could go the full amount of all possible years way over 40 or she could weigh things and agree with the prosecution who is asking for 30 minimum or she could go 25, etc. I guess I don't go much by news etc. and such opinions...

And hard to say if it will make any difference but is she going to make a statement and show any remorse or admit to anything...? A judge will weigh all of that or should as well... I honestly think though generally they have their minds somewhat made up before any argument by either side or statements... Theoretically though those things are to be given some weight too, not total weight by any means but considered...

My guess is it will fall between 15 and 25 although with that, there can be different possibilities or conditions I would think... Like no parole until such and such or possibility of parole after such and such, etc. Not real up on how federal guidelines are on that...

I think it will be 15 to 25 but hope for the weightier side and wouldn't be upset if the jduge went beyond either. We don't have to agree on that as we likely don't but that is how I feel and what I'd hope is more. And if she does offer something or provide something, I don't think it should lessen much for her unless it is good stuff that takes down a number of others and is seen through and enough to prosecute etc. and that no statute of limitations would preclude.
 
I don't think she will say much if she says anything. If she is hoping for an appeal it is unlikely she will show remorse either as that would be admitting guilt. (Unless she says something like she wishes she had never met Epstein) The judge has the three recommendations ranging from Probation (20-30) , Defence (<5) and Prosecution (30+) and all the comments to consider.

I did notice that some of the federal sentencing included (sometimes) hefty prison terms and probation, so that could also be an option here. Eg 5 years prison plus 15 years probation.

Just adding this article that discusses victims wanting to speak at the sentencing.


Also, found the article that mentions the tutoring of inmates. This also mentions she has been apart from Epstein for 15 years (so 2007 ?) and has had two relationships since then one with a Miami lawyer and the recent one where she married. Makes me wonder who took over her duties from 2007 onwards.

 
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Most usually find something to say even if not admitting guilt and some of course profess they innocence for the "last" time to the judge. Hard to say, her lawyers might help her craft something that carefully shows sympathy for the women without professing guilt or a part in it but then on the other hand, maybe that is unlikely as even doing that would be admitting that something happened to them...

I don't think it wise to stay silent entirely at sentencing but some do. Judges can be harsher with sentencing because the lack of taking responsibility for one's actions now that the guilt phase is over and she has been deemed guilty by a jury. Imo and from seeing same.

Her way and her lawyers way to date has been to complain and whine about what many if not most deal with in jail/prison. I guess for that reason and their ways and stance throughout, I don't see guilt being admitted in any fashion.

I'm sure many of the articles are put out there somehow by the defense and it sickens me the use of publicity that way when in so many cases defense whines about pretrial publicity on one hand but then uses publicity and the media on the other hand when they want it.

'While the tutoring sounds admirable on the surface, it also is no surprise and especially now that sentencing is upon her. All that good samaritan, citizen, prisoner is pretty common and especially with sentencing and the type of thing to show the judge look what she has been doing, being productive in jail, trying to give something back to the community, etc. Very common and most have seen it many a time and generally the timing is obvious as well... It is like so many the minute they go to even county jail for something instantly becoming God fearing born agaiin Christians and adopt such a behavior in the courtroom... But hey, not knocking that she is doing it... Just feel the reason may be self serving.

I think it unlikely the judge will throw the whole book at her with consecutive max sentences on each count but I think it just as unlikely the judge will lean towards the light side either. Again if a fair judge which no reason to believe she is not. A judge does not have to follow any recommendation or suggestion which honestly is both a good and bad thing imo, it gives one person a lot of power and that's why judges need to be so above board and fair and also why many attempt to influence them imo.

The only thing she has going for her is that first time offender thing also imo. And I don't see that as very significant. Her crimes went on for years on end and she was found guilty of several charges, not just one first time offense. I see quite a bit not in her favor on the other hand. No remorse, no admission of built (most likely), continuing such crimes for years, never knowing better even as the years go on or she gets older, etc.

While she may have "left" Epstein some years back now, it doesn't minimize the crimes she did commit. That's like saying when someone murders someone and the system and defense delays, etc. end up delaying the murder trial for years on end that it then is less serious and the offender shouldn't face as much time and that should not matter--not the case and wrong. Defense loves delays and it is thought to favor defense of course because witnesses forget, memories dull, some even die or can't be found, etc. BUT they are as guilty as they were when they did it and even though the public perception and outrage may soften over time or just be not as intense, a judge shouldn't go any lighter because of that although that is what is hoped with delays I'm sure...

So also seven though she has been away from Epstein for some years, so what? Is that supposed to change things for her? The crimes happened and it doesn't erase them. It may have stopped her from committing more or being part of more that she would have been charged with as well, that's her benefit for leaving.

All jmo.
 
Dude's got a point...


No ONE is going to believe that again. Not that that would stop such big name types with money, power and desperation...

Let's hope it is a precaution for the very same reason (that someone may be planning such and just ensuring her safety) and for her own sake or a precaution too for if she would "get" suicidal which there ahs been NO indication of. She hasn't done it this far and if she was going to herself, she would do it after a severe sentencing in my opinion, not before. So again, no one would believe it.

If she is in such and ends up dead, I will NEVER believe it. No way, not in my lifetime would I believe it.

And if such is in the works, it would be completely obvious. IF there is anyone around her with security or above superiors, i would set about covering with such surveillance that they catch what happens and by who... NO excuse for them not to cover every second 24/7 after Epstein with NO SLIP UPS. They would have NO EXCUSE.
 
No ONE is going to believe that again. Not that that would stop such big name types with money, power and desperation...

Let's hope it is a precaution for the very same reason (that someone may be planning such and just ensuring her safety) and for her own sake or a precaution too for if she would "get" suicidal which there ahs been NO indication of. She hasn't done it this far and if she was going to herself, she would do it after a severe sentencing in my opinion, not before. So again, no one would believe it.

If she is in such and ends up dead, I will NEVER believe it. No way, not in my lifetime would I believe it.

And if such is in the works, it would be completely obvious. IF there is anyone around her with security or above superiors, i would set about covering with such surveillance that they catch what happens and by who... NO excuse for them not to cover every second 24/7 after Epstein with NO SLIP UPS. They would have NO EXCUSE.
I don't either, but they at least have her on suicide watch now and hopefully somebody doing their job this time AND working cameras.
 
I don't either, but they at least have her on suicide watch now and hopefully somebody doing their job this time AND working cameras.
That's exactly what I mean. No excuses believable this time as they should have working cameras, working backup cameras and a third system to cover their arse. Not one just doing their job, but two, three and a fourth overseer. NO ONE will believe the same scenario again...
 
She was in solitary for most of the last two years so could not have done the tutoring before, due to Covid.

She has been away from Epstein for 15 years, (2007-2022) which is the same amount of time she was with him.(1992-2007). The crimes for which she was convicted were mid 90's (Jane) and early 2000's (Carolyn) IIRC.
 

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