Epstein, Maxwell et al: exposed in child sex trafficking

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Do we have a Jefferey Epstein thread?

 
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Well I have been complaining about Epsteins lenient deal all along, because I just couldn't understand it. Now it is becoming clear to me there was a cover up as well as illegality in the deal itself, even according to a judge. Maybe one day it will be revealed why that happened.
And whether I made it clear or not, I NEVER liked Epstein's deal NOR his suicide. He should be behind bars for life. I only differ in that giving her the same or less than him when his deal was so wrong, would also be wrong and would be yet another wrong. That is where we disagreed. It is shameful enough that one escaped justice, her escaping justice would just be a double wrong/injustice.

I have always understood what you mean but don't agree. His is the case that wrong was done in. Hers seems to have went as it should, through all the process and trial. HIS should have as well.

Yes, I have no doubt that was corrupt if not even illegal where creepy Epstein was concerned. It is maddening.
 
And whether I made it clear or not, I NEVER liked Epstein's deal NOR his suicide. He should be behind bars for life. I only differ in that giving her the same or less than him when his deal was so wrong, would also be wrong and would be yet another wrong. That is where we disagreed. It is shameful enough that one escaped justice, her escaping justice would just be a double wrong/injustice.

I have always understood what you mean but don't agree. His is the case that wrong was done in. Hers seems to have went as it should, through all the process and trial. HIS should have as well.

Yes, I have no doubt that was corrupt if not even illegal where creepy Epstein was concerned. It is maddening.
He was the mastermind, she was the assistant. Without him there would have been no crimes. There are many more accomplices/co-conspirators also. I don't believe it is over yet. It is good to know that there was something wrong and illegal with his Florida deal.
 
He was the mastermind, she was the assistant. Without him there would have been no crimes. There are many more accomplices/co-conspirators also. I don't believe it is over yet. It is good to know that there was something wrong and illegal with his Florida deal.
She didn't get life. He should have. And I agree it is long from over or it had better not be. Big fish are out there yet and they should not be immune.
 
He was the mastermind, she was the assistant. Without him there would have been no crimes. There are many more accomplices/co-conspirators also. I don't believe it is over yet. It is good to know that there was something wrong and illegal with his Florida deal.
We can not say for sure that there would be no crimes without him. She very easily could have just hooked up with a different perv. How do we know that isn't what she was looking for in a guy?
 
We can not say for sure that there would be no crimes without him. She very easily could have just hooked up with a different perv. How do we know that isn't what she was looking for in a guy?
While we can't know for sure, I have to say I've had the same thought and don['t disagree. She seemed to take to her role and relish the dominance and position of authority and even engaging in it all. That is just my take on it and my opinion of course. they both seem to feel superior to others and showed it as well. The testimony of the man who was what like the house manager or some such said a lot to me (just for one) and I found it very believable when matching it up with other things and behaviors of these two.
 
We can not say for sure that there would be no crimes without him. She very easily could have just hooked up with a different perv. How do we know that isn't what she was looking for in a guy?
I am judging by her record prior to and since Epstein, based on what was stated in court. Not sure how else we would know. Also, the fact there were additional co-conspirators granted immunity.

What I find is strange is that the authorities have the "black book" and flight manifests with all the details of the co-conspirators and victims yet they don't seem to be doing anything with it.
 
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I am judging by her record prior to and since Epstein, based on what was stated in court. Not sure how else we would know. Also, the fact there were additional co-conspirators granted immunity.

What I find is strange is that the authorities have the "black book" and flight manifests with all the details of the co-conspirators and victims yet they don't seem to be doing anything with it.
again, her case is not dependent upon other cases. Her case is her case and if she chose to not help herself out, there is nobody else to blame but her or that there is nobody else to blame because she was the main conspirator.
 
I am judging by her record prior to and since Epstein, based on what was stated in court. Not sure how else we would know. Also, the fact there were additional co-conspirators granted immunity.

What I find is strange is that the authorities have the "black book" and flight manifests with all the details of the co-conspirators and victims yet they don't seem to be doing anything with it.
Anyone given immunity likely flipped on Epstein or even on the two of them no? She may very likely have had that choice or could have explored it as well.

I'd like to see all others charged too/who deserve to be no doubt. Is a name in the black book and flight manifests enough? Someone backing it up or providing testimony would help like Ghislaine or matching it up against the "girls'" statements or testimony, that of other staff, etc. Again, she could have done this or offered this.

Hopefully they are full on investigating and putting cases together yet but hard to say.

Epstein escaped justice and if they let the other men do so as well, then it is just more evidence of corrupt powers that be that let powerful or big wig men and women off.
 
Anyone given immunity likely flipped on Epstein or even on the two of them no? She may very likely have had that choice or could have explored it as well.

I'd like to see all others charged too/who deserve to be no doubt. Is a name in the black book and flight manifests enough? Someone backing it up or providing testimony would help like Ghislaine or matching it up against the "girls'" statements or testimony, that of other staff, etc. Again, she could have done this or offered this.

Hopefully they are full on investigating and putting cases together yet but hard to say.

Epstein escaped justice and if they let the other men do so as well, then it is just more evidence of corrupt powers that be that let powerful or big wig men and women off.
Yes I would assume those now immune have given info on others including those in the black book. Time will tell.

The other point that I have seen made is that as Epstein is now dead, their immunity is no longer valid. Not sure about that - does immunity last forever regardless? What if new info becomes available, for example?

ETA this is how it works in the UK. Immunity for witnesses is given for a particular conviction. Once the conviction is achieved (or defendant is acquitted ) then that immunity is over. In the case of Epstein, the conviction/acquittal never happened because he died. So is that immunity in this instance now expired ? I am not familiar with the US immunity laws.

 
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Yes I would assume those now immune have given info on others including those in the black book. Time will tell.

The other point that I have seen made is that as Epstein is now dead, their immunity is no longer valid. Not sure about that - does immunity last forever regardless? What if new info becomes available, for example?

ETA this is how it works in the UK. Immunity for witnesses is given for a particular conviction. Once the conviction is achieved (or defendant is acquitted ) then that immunity is over. In the case of Epstein, the conviction/acquittal never happened because he died. So is that immunity in this instance now expired ? I am not familiar with the US immunity laws.

I will say that one thing I think we all agree on is we would like to see all prosecuted or held accountable that should be. That is also why I feel/felt the way I do/did about Ghislaine BUT I also feel it about the men involved AND women that were aware (wives of big wigs? party attendees that knew what others were doing?) And I DO NOT like that Epstein got off. In fact I hate the fact. So in all that I think most agree or feel that way.

When I put up the former post, the thought crossed my mind as well that immunity should now not exist or shouldn't have any longer once Epstein was gone. But not sure how it works and think any type of deal can possibly be struck or worked or pounded out but there may be parameters, especially in the federal system, I have no idea.

I really have no idea but I agree the question should be asked and reporters and others should be saying why are these men (presumably) still being protected and are they still immune?? I guess the possibility exists they used and are using their info still to look at others and/or all possible cases and facts and the immune ones may still be of use to them if not the worst offenders but can help hand over others or lead them down the right path in search of others and evidence, etc. Hard to say.

There is also the possibility we have corruption again or payoffs, threats, etc. AND all are hoping (both the deal givers and those getting deals or immunity) it will just be slid under the rug and forgotten that these men perhaps should no longer have immunity...

I guess the argument could be made that they did make a deal, were willing to testify or help and did so and therefore immunity should remain BUT we don't know what the immunity deals say.

The UK may have guidelines or laws re such but I am not sure if we do or not. I think if all sides agree any kind of deal can be struck but they risk if it is too sweet of a deal, the public and others scrutinizing and judging same and those who made it.

I can think of deals in nonfederal cases that still leave me outraged. Even one in Canada.

I hope of course more is coming but I worry all is above board or that others will not be charged. These two were so sickeningly high up the food chain in the sense of playing with powerful people in this world (or more accurately providing a playground and play things for them) anything is possible and some seriously powerful people probably want this under wraps and going away and as administrations come and go who knows what will happen... HOPEFULLY those in the fed courts will do their job above board but administrations can change how that all works and who is in charge as well...
 
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I will say that one thing I think we all agree on is we would like to see all prosecuted or held accountable that should be. That is also why I feel/felt the way I do/did about Ghislaine BUT I also feel it about the men involved AND women that were aware (wives of big wigs? party attendees that knew what others were doing?) And I DO NOT like that Epstein got off. In fact I hate the fact. So in all that I think most agree or feel that way.

When I put up the former post, the thought crossed my mind as well that immunity should now not exist or shouldn't have any longer once Epstein was gone. But not sure how it works and think any type of deal can possibly be struck or worked or pounded out but there may be parameters, especially in the federal system, I have no idea.

I really have no idea but I agree the question should be asked and reporters and others should be saying why are these men (presumably) still being protected and are they still immune?? I guess the possibility exists they used and are using their info still to look at others and/or all possible cases and facts and the immune ones may still be of use to them if not the worst offenders but can help hand over others or lead them down the right path in search of others and evidence, etc. Hard to say.

There is also the possibility we have corruption again or payoffs, threats, etc. AND all are hoping (both the deal givers and those getting deals or immunity) it will just be slid under the rug and forgotten that these men perhaps should no longer have immunity...

I guess the argument could be made that they did make a deal, were willing to testify or help and did so and therefore immunity should remain BUT we don't know what the immunity deals say.

The UK may have guidelines or laws re such but I am not sure if we do or not. I think if all sides agree any kind of deal can be struck but they risk if it is too sweet of a deal, the public and others scrutinizing and judging same and those who made it.

I can think of deals in nonfederal cases that still leave me outraged. Even one in Canada.

I hope of course more is coming but I worry all is above board or that others will not be charged. These two were so sickeningly high up the food chain in the sense of playing with powerful people in this world (or more accurately providing a playground and play things for them) anything is possible and some seriously powerful people probably want this under wraps and going away and as administrations come and go who knows what will happen... HOPEFULLY those in the fed courts will do their job above board but administrations can change how that all works and who is in charge as well...
From what I have read, the immunities were for four female assistants/employees of Epstein, not for any of the men. I also wonder if some of the actual victims (like Roberts for example) were given immunity from their roles in recruiting other young girls for Epstein. Obviously there is quite a lot we do not know. Eg. Did all the John Does get named yet?
 
From what I have read, the immunities were for four female assistants/employees of Epstein, not for any of the men. I also wonder if some of the actual victims (like Roberts for example) were given immunity from their roles in recruiting other young girls for Epstein. Obviously there is quite a lot we do not know. Eg. Did all the John Does get named yet?
So there are no deals with the men or the "johns" so to speak? I guess that could be looked at as a good thing in that they can still go after them but do they plan to...?

Yes there is a TON we don't know and yet this is some years in... I'd like to think now that Maxwell's trial is over, they will get onto more...
 
OMG she is moving to a prison in Florida now and will clean toilets according to DM. Wonder what is really behind this ?

Not uncommon at all for prisoners to get transferred. Most do it to be closer to family so they can have a chance to visit, some due to overcrowding.
 
Not uncommon at all for prisoners to get transferred. Most do it to be closer to family so they can have a chance to visit, some due to overcrowding.
Florida was where most of the victims originated. I don't think she has family there, but perhaps she has friends there. It seems that the BOP made the decision to not send her to her choice of prison, which was in Connecticut. This is a females only prison also.
 
Florida was where most of the victims originated. I don't think she has family there, but perhaps she has friends there. It seems that the BOP made the decision to not send her to her choice of prison, which was in Connecticut. This is a females only prison also.
They often do not get their first choice. Females are also more limited on where they can go as there are fewer and many are overcrowded. Not sure who's choice Florida was, but it is not uncommon for them to get transferred from where they were sentenced, especially for federal sentences, for what ever reason.
 
Not uncommon at all for prisoners to get transferred. Most do it to be closer to family so they can have a chance to visit, some due to overcrowding.
It shouldn't be and isn't though typically up to the prisoner especially when first assigned or the first years of sentence. Maybe federal is different but I highly doubt it, in fact I would think it almost more unlikely the felon or felon's family has any say in the matter. I guess I don't know but if so, it makes me even more disgusted with our system.

In fact to me it sounds like it is fitting the bill with this, a very interesting one to listens to. I'd like the take of every one on it.

Do we really think she kept her mouth shut because she gives a sh*t about these men? She had other reasons. Do we really think the big name powerful men just don't care?

 
Under 9 minutes and well worth listening to.

We have already heard about her possibly going to the UK which I didn't like the minute I heard it... And more on it.
 

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