JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell GUILTY

GrandmaBear · Jun 26, 2020

Kimster said:
Well, it's child abandonment and obstruction. I suppose she can still be held on the obstruction, but at $1 million bail?

Well, Chad's crimes are low counts in relation to the bond as they put it and it is the surrounding circumstances or whatever and continuing investigation, deaths surrounding them, etc. that made it 1 million. I can't recall but it was things like that argued. I think similar would happen with her if she asked for a reduction even now or I hope it would. I also think it would have to be pretty low for her to make any bond (guessing). I would not doubt we see her with a public defender soon.

Kimster · Jun 26, 2020

Cousin Dupree said:
Assaulting an officer should be in there.

I didn't see it when I was looking, but I wasn't looking at her arrest record.

Kimster · Jun 26, 2020

Cousin Dupree said:
Oooops! I was thinking of the Gannon Stauch case.

Oh never mind! Lol

GrandmaBear · Jun 26, 2020

Kimster said:
Good morning! Here's a .pdf link to the affidavit. Although I heard Linda read it last night, I'm going to read it again. There's a LOT of new info in the doc.

https://s3.us-east-1.wasabisys.com/localnews8.com/2020/06/Chad-Daybell-Affidavit-of-Probable-Cause.pdf

Wow was that a long read. i should have stopped and left some for another time but tons and tons of info. Have comments but too many to sort right now. Biggest one, the gunshot and need to explain it leaves me thinking Tylee was shot on the property, or perhaps the barn... So messed up on dates of all in this...

GrandmaBear · Jun 26, 2020

Kimster said:
Daybell watched LE recover the kids' remains from his daughter's house, who lived across the street. As LE observed him leaving her residence, they pursued him in his vehicle and arrested him.

An odd thing in my mind is that his daughter moved out of her house and into Chad's a day or two after her father's arrest. That seems so weird to me, unless they already were planning on this and it just happened to fall at the same time as his arrest.

That's the affidavit in a nutshell. Again, I suggest you read it for yourselves. What do you think about it? Do you think they will be able to use Alex as their scapegoat somehow?

I think even if they try to blame Alex, the Doomsday Couple is Doomed as they should be! There is enough info to how they knew or were part of it all.

kdg411 · Jun 26, 2020

We can assume that Alex buried the children with Chad however I'm not convinced he would have murdered them. JJ & Tylee's cause of death will likely lead to Chad & Lori, imo. At least I hope it does.

Possible Charges:
Alex - accessory before & after
Chad - ?
Lori - ?

What does everyone think?

SheWhoMustNotBeNamed · Jun 26, 2020

I just hope they're able to come up with cause/manner of death. With the state of the remains it may be difficult. Toxicology maybe?

Lori was originally charged with "solicitation of a crime". That could be the murders themselves or hiding the bodies or something else? Like Kimster said I think they'll have to amend/drop the "desertion/nonsupport of children" charges.
I think Chad will land with the murder charges. I just hope they're able to grab onto something other than circumstantial for that. Otherwise the defense WILL try to pin it ALL on Alex.

Alex - none because he's deceased
Chad - Destruction of Evidence, Murder
Lori - Resisting/Obstructing an Officer, Solicitation of a Crime, Contempt, Accessory to Murder

Not sure. Just throwing stuff out there.

Skitt · Jun 27, 2020

I haven't been able to keep up with this one. All these people confuse me a lot. Do you believe Alex killed the kids? Why would he/motive? And then why was he killed? So much to sort out. could he have been set up somehow?

GrandmaBear · Jun 27, 2020

kdg411 said:
We can assume that Alex buried the children with Chad however I'm not convinced he would have murdered them. JJ & Tylee's cause of death will likely lead to Chad & Lori, imo. At least I hope it does.

Possible Charges:
Alex - accessory before & after
Chad - ?
Lori - ?

What does everyone think?

I am not sure, Alex has killed before, at least Charles, by gunshot. there was a gunshot heard here, at least on the one occasion. However, if Tammy was poisoned, I would think that would most likely be by Charles as he had the easiest access to her.

Both Chad and Alex are placed at his property. I think Chad is hung personally either way. Lori will be the hardest unless they have more which they very well might but even then, there is a lot on her already. Dates and times of Alex being at her house, remarks, movements, etc. I the phone info in the affidavit is the tip of the iceberg. And not all provided yet by a long shot.

Interesting to see they had Tammy's cell phone or at least that text. I also found it, probably minor, but interesting Chad sent her like 3 texts and she sent him one brief response.

That entire affidavit just hit home again but times 10 how absolutely evil they are. At the same time throughout, I was also thinking constantly how absolutely stupid they are. So many examples.

Just the shooting of the raccoon and the OVER need to explain it and yah, they are nocturnal animals Chad Dumbbell. One of many examples.

I like someone earlier here said, do not believe still Alex's death is natural. I mean a strange coincidence can happen but everything before and after is just too uncanny with how it fits. I do not know if anything can be, but I think it more likely something was given to him that helped induce a "natural death" or something on that order. I am not discrediting the medical examiner one bit, probably even correct, I know nothing about such things, but I cannot let go of how it fits in, in more ways than one.

All jmo.

GrandmaBear · Jun 27, 2020

Skitt said:
I haven't been able to keep up with this one. All these people confuse me a lot. Do you believe Alex killed the kids? Why would he/motive? And then why was he killed? So much to sort out. could he have been set up somehow?

I don't think anyone was set up in the sense of the first acts for sure, I think at least Alex, Lori, and Chad were all aware and involved. A short answer to why for Alex, is he believed the Zombie thing Chad "taught" them and was told his niece and nephews were zombies. To get the real soul back, one has to kill the zombie to release it or some such. Meaning once the kids became Zombies they were doomed, something bad had taken over them and pushed them back. Only one solution. And that is to kill them.

Trying to just give a quick broad explanation of a bit of it.

GrandmaBear · Jun 27, 2020

SheWhoMustNotBeNamed said:
I just hope they're able to come up with cause/manner of death. With the state of the remains it may be difficult. Toxicology maybe?

Lori was originally charged with "solicitation of a crime". That could be the murders themselves or hiding the bodies or something else? Like Kimster said I think they'll have to amend/drop the "desertion/nonsupport of children" charges.
I think Chad will land with the murder charges. I just hope they're able to grab onto something other than circumstantial for that. Otherwise the defense WILL try to pin it ALL on Alex.

Alex - none because he's deceased
Chad - Destruction of Evidence, Murder
Lori - Resisting/Obstructing an Officer, Solicitation of a Crime, Contempt, Accessory to Murder

Not sure. Just throwing stuff out there.

I think a lot may depend on whether Chad and Lori present a united "story" or whether they are completely turned on the other. If separate, it is going to be a big mess. Lori blames Chad perhaps, Chad blames Alex, or one blames both others, etc.

I believe Lori can be charged with murder but when I really think about it with what we now know, she is going to be the most difficult. But they likely have far more than we know. They definitely can place her in what would almost be like a hiring a hitman situation I think, where she wanted it and was well aware. I think there is a wealth of phone information we have not even heard yet.

There is also the Jeep she continued to have, her clear knowledge her kids were not alive and safe by not providing the info and a lot more.

This case is going to remain interesting no doubt.

Melanie Gibb is going to be key right? She said in her recent release that the only way to release the original good spirit from a Zombie was to kill it. Lori knew this. So even if she would try to claim that she did not know and thought Chad took the kids somewhere safe and he told her they were safe, she knew better. Boy, I don't know either.

Lori's hearings are coming up. Many still think she also flipped on Chad.

Just throwing things out there as well and thoughts as they come.

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

GrandmaBear said:
Wow was that a long read. i should have stopped and left some for another time but tons and tons of info. Have comments but too many to sort right now. Biggest one, the gunshot and need to explain it leaves me thinking Tylee was shot on the property, or perhaps the barn... So messed up on dates of all in this...

Yes! I forgot to note that. I wonder if she was drugged and then he shot her at Chad's house because it's more out in the country? I don't know. That was really really sad and creepy. I looked at pictures of Alex afterward and I just get so creeped out. I can't hardly look at his pictures anymore. Melanie Gibb said that he truly believed in zombies.

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

kdg411 said:
We can assume that Alex buried the children with Chad however I'm not convinced he would have murdered them. JJ & Tylee's cause of death will likely lead to Chad & Lori, imo. At least I hope it does.

Possible Charges:
Alex - accessory before & after
Chad - ?
Lori - ?

What does everyone think?

He killed Charles Vallow and he tried to kill Tammy Daybell and Brandon Boudreax. I definitely think Alex could have killed them. however, the other two were in on it and they're just as guilty as if they did it themselves.

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

GrandmaBear said:
I am not sure, Alex has killed before, at least Charles, by gunshot. there was a gunshot heard here, at least on the one occasion. However, if Tammy was poisoned, I would think that would most likely be by Charles as he had the easiest access to her.

Both Chad and Alex are placed at his property. I think Chad is hung personally either way. Lori will be the hardest unless they have more which they very well might but even then, there is a lot on her already. Dates and times of Alex being at her house, remarks, movements, etc. I the phone info in the affidavit is the tip of the iceberg. And not all provided yet by a long shot.

Interesting to see they had Tammy's cell phone or at least that text. I also found it, probably minor, but interesting Chad sent her like 3 texts and she sent him one brief response.

That entire affidavit just hit home again but times 10 how absolutely evil they are. At the same time throughout, I was also thinking constantly how absolutely stupid they are. So many examples.

Just the shooting of the raccoon and the OVER need to explain it and yah, they are nocturnal animals Chad Dumbbell. One of many examples.

I like someone earlier here said, do not believe still Alex's death is natural. I mean a strange coincidence can happen but everything before and after is just too uncanny with how it fits. I do not know if anything can be, but I think it more likely something was given to him that helped induce a "natural death" or something on that order. I am not discrediting the medical examiner one bit, probably even correct, I know nothing about such things, but I cannot let go of how it fits in, in more ways than one.

All jmo.

Interesting what you wrote about Alex's death. I guess from what Linda says, both Alex and Tammy had foam coming from their mouths when they died. I don't know how common that is because I don't know a lot about death. Does anyone else know?

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

GrandmaBear said:
I don't think anyone was set up in the sense of the first acts for sure, I think at least Alex, Lori, and Chad were all aware and involved. A short answer to why for Alex, is he believed the Zombie thing Chad "taught" them and was told his niece and nephews were zombies. To get the real soul back, one has to kill the zombie to release it or some such. Meaning once the kids became Zombies they were doomed, something bad had taken over them and pushed them back. Only one solution. And that is to kill them.

Trying to just give a quick broad explanation of a bit of it.

Yeah that's pretty much how I understand it. They're doing them a favor by killing them, according to Chad.

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

GrandmaBear said:
I think a lot may depend on whether Chad and Lori present a united "story" or whether they are completely turned on the other. If separate, it is going to be a big mess. Lori blames Chad perhaps, Chad blames Alex, or one blames both others, etc.

I believe Lori can be charged with murder but when I really think about it with what we now know, she is going to be the most difficult. But they likely have far more than we know. They definitely can place her in what would almost be like a hiring a hitman situation I think, where she wanted it and was well aware. I think there is a wealth of phone information we have not even heard yet.

There is also the Jeep she continued to have, her clear knowledge her kids were not alive and safe by not providing the info and a lot more.

This case is going to remain interesting no doubt.

Melanie Gibb is going to be key right? She said in her recent release that the only way to release the original good spirit from a Zombie was to kill it. Lori knew this. So even if she would try to claim that she did not know and thought Chad took the kids somewhere safe and he told her they were safe, she knew better. Boy, I don't know either.

Lori's hearings are coming up. Many still think she also flipped on Chad.

Just throwing things out there as well and thoughts as they come.

I'll be surprised if Lori flipped on Chad but she could have. I saw an interview with the local news guy who interviewed Melanie Gibb the first time and he said that Melanie told him that she is definitely going to be testifying and she's prepared.

Kimster · Jun 27, 2020

Thanks for discussing this case with me!

Cousin Dupree · Jun 27, 2020

GrandmaBear said:
I think a lot may depend on whether Chad and Lori present a united "story" or whether they are completely turned on the other. If separate, it is going to be a big mess. Lori blames Chad perhaps, Chad blames Alex, or one blames both others, etc.

I believe Lori can be charged with murder but when I really think about it with what we now know, she is going to be the most difficult. But they likely have far more than we know. They definitely can place her in what would almost be like a hiring a hitman situation I think, where she wanted it and was well aware. I think there is a wealth of phone information we have not even heard yet.

There is also the Jeep she continued to have, her clear knowledge her kids were not alive and safe by not providing the info and a lot more.

This case is going to remain interesting no doubt.

Melanie Gibb is going to be key right? She said in her recent release that the only way to release the original good spirit from a Zombie was to kill it. Lori knew this. So even if she would try to claim that she did not know and thought Chad took the kids somewhere safe and he told her they were safe, she knew better. Boy, I don't know either.

Lori's hearings are coming up. Many still think she also flipped on Chad.

Just throwing things out there as well and thoughts as they come.

Well, in 25 days she and Chad will be set free.

GrandmaBear · Jun 27, 2020

Kimster said:
Yes! I forgot to note that. I wonder if she was drugged and then he shot her at Chad's house because it's more out in the country? I don't know. That was really really sad and creepy. I looked at pictures of Alex afterward and I just get so creeped out. I can't hardly look at his pictures anymore. Melanie Gibb said that he truly believed in zombies.

Yeah, I never even thought nor did it cross my mind that either child was shot. I do feel there had to be a reason for that gun shot and his need to explain it as it was unusual at his property as apparently were fires. When I get some time, I need to go see, I am guessing this was when Tammy was at her parents? I am not up on podcasts either and Linda likely covered this.

Tylee (I think that date of the shot fits the first one missing, too jumbled to be sure, but could have been even in their vehicle and driven into maybe the barn (I would have to look at property pics again) where they shot her and if taken out the back of the barn after passed in something, a neighbor would never even have seen her on the property, just heard the gun shot and burning most likely.

GrandmaBear · Jun 27, 2020

Kimster said:
Interesting what you wrote about Alex's death. I guess from what Linda says, both Alex and Tammy had foam coming from their mouths when they died. I don't know how common that is because I don't know a lot about death. Does anyone else know?

I have been at the bedside of 4 deaths/4 last moments. I never saw foam. No expert, just not that I have seen. It may depend on the cause?

JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell *GUILTY*

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JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell GUILTY