JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell GUILTY

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Kimster said:
So, a raccoon was buried in the yard on Sept. 9th AND a teenage girl was buried in the yard on Sept. 9th and no one knew about Tylee?????? And Garth says they BOTH were there that day? And I wondered why a 2nd grand jury convened over Garth's testimony during the first grand jury?

I don't wonder anymore.

EXACTLY. There are things in this I want to know dates and times again and one I already wondered in catching up with this whole thread tonight was again Alex's time at the church and when he then headed to a hotel didn't he or back to his apartment or Lori's (I get mixed up with the deaths of all three as to all that). Wasn't it like tennish when he was at the church the night Tammy died?

But YES and it just so happened too not only a raccoon was buried AND a teenage girl got buried but SOMEONE who we are to believe was Emma googled southwest wind... Just a both too much wouldn't we all say I'm guessing...? Of course she should be careful maybe she did Google it FOR DAD and knew of EVERYTHING. If she keeps it up that's what is going to be wondered next... I mean Chad comes across as a door knob but is actually very evil with much that stirs beneath the surface. Are his kids really naive or were they part of the plan and in the know all along?

I'm really not saying they were but I AM saying with the sh*t they are saying and claiming, well... NONE of their reactions were normal imo and still are not. I mean were they all promised glory, this was their g od's plan, there that worked, I put a space in so no capital and of course there'd be that sweet life insurance policy AND a TRIP!! And believed mom was meant to go it was the plan of their g of per the exalted Chad the Toad.

I know this sounds out there and I am not there don't get me wrong but theyd' better watch it. Chad too so many thought for so long was snookered and just some typical MAN who ended up led by his STorm and how it was treated. He is anything BUT. He is evil personified.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Tresir said:
I think the raccoon Garth was on about was earlier in the year when he was camping in the garden.

Not sure about that having just read this stuff a few days old for the rest of you by now. There was more than that raccoon referred to and I think he did talk about Chad being excited THAT day and no he was not there when dad shot it or buried it but dad was telling him about it. I may be mixed up, trying to catch up fast but I don't think so.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Kimster said:
Which has nothing to do with Sept 9th, so why bring it up? Also, why bring up the perjury accusation? Doesn't make sense.

I can only figure perjury was brought up as they could show Garth was never charged and more hints of what LE and the system was doing to the kids and therefore Chad, etc. Officer driving by the house per Joe, officer at the gym per Emma, Garth even though bought Mc Donald's feeling they were trying to make him change his story, and so on. The entire system is corrupt and was after Chad and this family if they did not tell the truth and were crossing lines and after children even. I think that's what it is about with bringing it up. The GJ did NOT find him or recommend him charged with perjury (the second one) and they are trying to make it look like a witch hunt and the GJ is corrupt the LE is every detective is and so on, prosecutor, you name it. I can't see acquittal but after all they only need one person for a hung jury and with what some LDS think of LE and the govt., and if any are on the jury, well there ya go... Of course it is different if THEIR people are in place on the force or in the courts...

I know it might not be PC but I have watched and and know also a lot of facts about this outside this case. I put this church with Scientology for similar reasons but in some ways it may be worse and is accepted as more mainstream. I do NOT mean all raised in or part of it are bad or see it...

So that's why I think Prior brought it up. Poor put up on Garth and after all he is a double victim, mom dead, dad in jail. AND because it shows the system is corrupt and were after them PLUS he also might be pre emptying if it comes up that there were grand juries about GArth and perjury.

I know, I am still way behind and back here where you guys I don't know are probably on todays stuff but I am plowing through and I would quit but I think these kids' testimony etc. has been waited for and I watched BOTH somehow in no time (well listened more so most of the time and watched) and part of Joe's but not all and think it bears even if I'm late takes on it and any discussion it still may bring if anyone wants to.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Tresir said:
Garth is still in school, lives at home yet has a wife? So where was his wife that night?

Since this is a few days ago you probably already know. Garth was not married yet. And he as teaching I believe part time and the haunted house was a second gig. I actually wonder now that we know he is the oldest why he was not married since in LDS dating more than a few months is long and I think it was said about TAmmy and Chad in fact. All their kids I believe are married off but there must have been some issue with Garth resisting or some such because as the oldest, you'd think that would be the example.... What case was it I learned a lot and if someone is 25 and not married they are an old maid. not sure the men are considered the same but I think that thing is still there to do so. You date someone in your ward or at least of your faith in another and then no time is wasted, marriage.

His wife was not a wife at the time but was someone supposedly per Gath told he found Tammy on the couch. It's interesting that there was a point (listen to it if any get the chance) in Garth's testimony that he wondered what the rules were or law and he wasn't sure and no one helped him out and could not and I personally think he meant whether he had to answer legally etc. since the two are now fortunately married and how convenient is that.... Been a week I may have that wrong but I think that's what the hint was at. He married the person who claimed he told a different story to and now there is spousal privilege? I am so behind here but I DID pack in both testimonies of both kids and so I may not have it exactly correct but it is still odd Garth as the oldest wasn't married, was living at home and ended up marrying someone who told a different story. Per Blake anyhow.

It might be a stretch but I am guess or wonder if Chad as he did with Zulema and Alex, himself and Lori (meant to be together and Tammy to die young) Mel P leaving Brandon and marrying a basically unknown Ian allegedly, that perhaps Garth was told he was meant to marry this person because it was their g od's plan and Chad was exalted and that Garth and she were meant to be together and were part of the 144k.

I think there is sooooooooo much here we don't know and never will. And MUCH went on we will never know of with MORE than we will ever hear of.

Anyhow no, Garth was not married then and I believe was teaching part time and had the gig of the haunted house where he dressed up in costume to scare people... Also said he was shy and an introvert and Prior tried to say that was like his dad.... HMMMMMM.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Kimster said:
I didn't catch that about the wife? Did they get married after Tammy died?

Since I am behind you have likely already had answers but they were not married when Tammy died but she was one per at least what Lindsey Blake insinuated he told a different story to. And then later married her.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Kimster said:
Tammy was fine at school and then unwell at home? What did Chad give her????????????????

I am allowing for this as well. I actually do not buy the poor health she was hiding per Emma etc. HOWEVER if the kids truly were seeing changes in her and her energy level, tiredness etc. or that night particularly yes what did Chad GIVE her as you say? And IF it had been over recent weeks even what was he GIVING HER throughout leading up to let kids etc. see this change in her? Personally I think the kids are lying OTHER than maybe that night IF they are truly innocent because if fine at school and then they truly did witness such (and are not lying well the plan was in place and maybe such was part). Just like with Alex and even suspicions or maybe HOPES JJ or Tylee were given something rather than suffering as they did consciously maybe Tammy was given something too...

We will likely NEVER KNOW the entire truth or all details of any. Because Alex is dead and no one else and certainly not Lori or Chad would eve admit to or share such EVER in this lifetime and isn't it like their millionth reincarnation or some such LOL but not.

I want to point something else out which maybe does not relate to this answer or post of yours but both Emma and Garth tried to distance themselves from the OLD school beliefs of Chad in the LDS. Emma however said her mother was even maybe more that way than their dad. And yet then she goes on about them rating people and casting and mom doing it too and how she FELT it when they did it for her where she had someone else in her body or some such (yet she doesn't have their same beliefs or fundamental beliefs and is more progressive, another contradiction as there are many of in her testimony). Garth said similar and said he didn't believe entirely as dad did and for one he teaches evolution and the earth is a billion or I forget whatever years old rather than like 6000 or whatever as most religions think. They are DOING THIS ON PURPOSE in the testimony. Showing they are NOT just going along with dad and believe otherwise themselves to show they are witnesses at trial that are NOT just by dad's book, I'm tired I know what I mean but am not putting it right. Showing they are not a nut like Lori or if anyone thinks their dad is, but they can BELIEVE their testimony because they aren't little robotic children of Chad.... I kind of beg to differ.... All of this has been crafted but unfortunately contradictions can be found throughout. I suspect that is what the first Grand Jury saw. Emma did it many a time.

They are trying to save dad. Not sure why honestly. I adored my dad and I miss him so much and he was the most pure and good man I'd ever known. I know daughters can be biased but not t the point as life went on that I never saw he was human and was not perfect and had his things. But had he EVER done even the parts of things these kids know about and admit to now and have seen, and if I believed what this nutty bunch does, I would have had to tell myself this was not my dad, and someone else was there in his place (and I don't believe in zombies that way etc.) because my dad truly without reservation would NEVER do such things. So really with what these two kids now kind of admit to and know and probably prefer to think Lori led him to it all, wh is it they aren't thinking it isn't their dad and their dad needed a casting and as possessed SINCE Emma says this kind of shi*t when it comes to helping her dad. Oh mom casted her out, dad did, she felt someone else was in her or with her... So WHY is it they don't think Chad got possessed on that thinking or is a zombie....?

See NONE of it works from Emma. Garth wasn't quite as much testimony. And I did listen to both as I said and don't know how but I put it first over catching up here or on any case with the no time I had.

We know these cases and I don't even have the words to explain it all but the jury will notice these things but they will be not as knowing of all the case/s through he years and talk of all and more. However, as hard as that may be, as convoluted as knowing more gets for all of us, it may make it simpler for them.

Seriously these kids should have been thinking Chad possessed when he did this and screwed around on mom and more. I mean they were taught this stuff. The say and Emma sure does nad felt it herself when they rid her of her "guest" but Chad cheating on mom, drawing death percentages and the people ending up dead including their own mom and Lori's kids, no that's just a temptress that swayed him and he is not a zombie, dark, or taken over?

I am losing how to say this, hopefully it makes some sense. Emma who perhaps believes her mom was (dark and death percentage, even though she has never said that...) can't figure maybe that's what was going on with dad too... AS an excuse? NOPE.

Hey EMMA, dad could NEVER be a ZOMBIE right? and never have a death percentage as he is ETERNAL and CHOSEN? And the reason he was with LORI IS this is all in the visions, past probations and important people they were. BUT MOM and JJ and TYLEE can be right? But the fact dad started doing all this weird **** and cheating on your mom and getting involve din this stuff and murders surround him does not mean HE must have been possessed and needs a casting? I swear she can't even SEE the contradictions here.

Oh also in Emma's testimony if you watch it she made a remark about her mom liking to play VIDEO games... There was a fair bit about this I think when Lindsey Blake crossed... And it was meant as an insult imo to her mother and was an explanation for something else, like exercising or some such, and then she also talked of her doing a WII exercise thing.

And around that time Emma also talked of her mom never being too tired to take care of daily tasks all have to do or meet life in general. I think enough of us here can identify when living in a bad relationship, always having done it all, and women especially being expected to and then if you have a spending and cheating hub and children that are needy and apparently never go home but live there when they have a home across the street, the best supermom hits a wall on occasion and now grandma too.

Emma seems to judge that and have a thing to be that perfect mom replacement but let's hear what she has to say in 20 or 30 years and see how she is doing....

It's like Garth saying he had to be mom's muscle. OMG. That's NORMAL. You are living at home (why?). You are male. You are younger. Earn your KEEP.

Good Lord Tammy had a bunch of 'em. And was probably taught to take care of and never complain etc. WTF were you doing over there every night Emma per your testimony (but then she kind of contradicts that later). Can mom not come home and just veg after all her years with your father and raising you and now trying like heck to be there for you and your kids and the school kids and everyone while she had a juvenile husband running around, controlling her one bit of numbing by grandma saying no more video games. GROW UP. And you are doing that thing of what your mom likely did, you can do it. Let's see for how many years....

Married seven years is it? Watch out for the itch. A newborn. Three kids I think. At least you've had a year off in between on pregnancies but I am averaging. I am also trying to figure out your husband chopping wood but checking phone for FB posts... The paintball night... Not a paintball gun, I don't think anyone here buys that..

There's a lot in testimony that for all of us who have watched this case from day one (anyone look ever at the first few pages of that in this thread and what we've come to know since oh my) that Nate as good as he is can't cover and even his nightlies, there's too much and he says go watch. I don't have time and certainly haven't done so with most witnesses on P side etc. and have to count on the summaries BUT I would say watch the kids. And Joseph murray.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

I know I am way behind so you all probably know this but I quit here and went to YT to see Nate's and hmm. Haven't watched yet but Prior is likely resting soon AND Emma may be coming back,I was hoping in rebuttal.... HMM.

You likely may all already know this from today's stuff but I didn't. and for anyone who didn't and I've only watched a few minutes so far but here in case others haven't been able to keep up or want a recap.

Here is Nate. Maybe already been posted. Again I am pages behind here.

GrandmaBear · May 22, 2024

Listening. I may actually way behind have called It right or close. Emma there are questions with as to her testimony.. Oh boy. No we we know Prior wouldn't necessarily want to do that although he did not release her, I'm thinking it will be prosecution that will go fire with her... She they are watching all I'd bet on it and PREPARING NOW. LIARS.

Cousin Dupree · May 22, 2024

GrandmaBear said:
I think so. It complicates things. Just like when Emma claimed Chad was not "hiding" in Hawaii and they gave LE his number and told them he was in Hawaii. Prior then pulled one imo that so they knew exactly where they were and so on (I don't think she likely ever said what rented AirBNB or address of whatever, they are doing semantics, and we all know how many numbers Chad and Lori had.

She said dad was NOT hiding where he went and Prior said took public flights, public information meaning not under another name, not using someone else's credit card, I don't mean public necessarily just not hidden or where cops couldn't find and so on.

My point is both Chad and Lori thought screwing up and getting into a different county, state, etc. would make things harder plus they think of LE as dumb. Look how Charles case was handled. and I do think they were surprised when this got gotten after and never expected such re the kids and how it blew up... I do think they were going to feel from Hawaii next if necessary.

It is another lie in my opinion about Chad going to talk to some certain attorney although I guess it is possible he thought if he got there then the arrest he knew was coming after both kids were found he was in the presence of one. And she plays down that he was speeding or hell bent, he wasn't but cops CHASED HIM DOWN the bad meanies.

Just another example of TOO many things Emma gives excuses for and claims to almost be in his head, his mother's and present for every moment of every day and very conversation the two had with anyone or each other in their entire life.

Juries aren't STUPID.

Juries aren't stupid? Explain Robert Durst's Galveston trial, and Casey Anthony's Juries then. Juries can be stupid. Never take anything for granted.

I'll be surprised if they find him not guilty, but won't find it unprecedented.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Cousin Dupree said:
Juries aren't stupid? Explain Robert Durst's Galveston trial, and Casey Anthony's Juries then. Juries can be stupid. Never take anything for granted.

I'll be surprised if they find him not guilty, but won't find it unprecedented.

We have been there a million times and they are a drop in the bucket for a percentage to those that get it right. And its' always Casey and OJ, Case and OJ, now you add Durst. Same ones all of the time that EVERYONE in the nation cites because that''s about how rare it is. Two of these three were famous and Casey's case had flaws from the get go.

I'd also suspect less stupidity than influence or pay off and rigging.

Don't tell me to take nothing for granted, I don't compared to many for obvious reasons, a ton of them.

And no for the most part they aren't stupid. Those that are responsible, do not try to get out of serving and do their duty generally are committed, responsible, hard working people.

I'd also add that people on the trials you mentioned may have well wanted on the jury for other reasons like profiting and fame at the end of such trials.

You want to see what sounds like a NOT stupid jury, go listen to Nate and his juror interview. A very intelligent woman and it sounds like she was as impressed with the rest of the jurors as I was with her.

You're all wet here. Most juries are not stupid and most get it right every single day.

Your percentages in this are about the same as wrongful convictions these days compared to right ones.

And what I've heard the last few days from Nate is how attentive THIS jury is being.

I'm not going to argue more than this once a subject that's been beat to death and an argument which does not have enough of a basis or even a significant percentage to be argued.

I'd add that Durst and OJ were Los Angeles County, California, now THAT'S startling isn't it.... So few you ever name and two are in the same county. I mean wow what ARE the odds of that... Years apart but same county. Is it the ilk of juror that live there? Or something in the water.... Bribes? Bad prosecutors, dirty cops, what? Wannabe movie stars who can't go against someone of fame? Gee. I wonder.

I could maybe agree based on that perhaps that jurors in Los Angeles County are stupid or prosecutors are just bad or something.

Done with this as I'm not caught up on any case and I'm not going to waste more time on it.

Chad's going to be found guilty and may well get the DP. Can I know this, of course not but I have total faith in it. There will be NO acquittal, I will BET you, come on take me up on it, seriously.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

GrandmaBear said:
I know I am way behind so you all probably know this but I quit here and went to YT to see Nate's and hmm. Haven't watched yet but Prior is likely resting soon AND Emma may be coming back,I was hoping in rebuttal.... HMM.

You likely may all already know this from today's stuff but I didn't. and for anyone who didn't and I've only watched a few minutes so far but here in case others haven't been able to keep up or want a recap.

Here is Nate. Maybe already been posted. Again I am pages behind here.

Little Ms. Emma may well have blown her father's case rather than helping and I'm not surprised. Lies don't pay and get you tripped up.

I think there will be one grand finale here. I found it odd there seemed to be no mention of keeping Emma on subpoena by the prosecution but was unsure how that works for rebuttal, etc. and they did not have her up in their case in chief. The insurance thing was major and yet nothing big seemed to be made over it at the time or end of that day... She was CAUGHT in it but even watching the questioning, no big drama unfolded and Blake got her and Emma didn't overly react and things moved on... But NOW we know it wasn't being ignored or forgotten which I really wondered about as I knew it was big but it seemed like no one was making it big at the time...

I don't know that I will catch up with all posts here but can say I watched both kids' full testimonies and have seen all or most of Nate's nightlies this week, I think all actually so I'd dare say I am as up on it as anyone even if I haven't read all posts. I may still try since it is early and before a new day of court.

So Prior is about to rest already or has and then we are going to get rebuttal and I think it will be INTERESTING.

To me, what Emma was doing THROUGHOUT was obvious and even though kept tame and unexcited in her delivery was too much to ever believe. When you have to explain away way too many facts or coincidences that does it for me. They and Prior had done a little bit of everything here... Trying to make LE the big bad guy against these poor CHILDREN and dad, explain every damning thing which Emma mostly does plus takes the blame for some things like the googling wind, blame Tammy for her own poor health and more and some other hints of things like of course that Alex snuck on the property and did this all himself, and then throw in Garth and Joe for a bit of backup and support for a few things Emma said and more.

I don't like defense attorneys quite often, clearly, and don't compliment them but Prior knows his job and the law imo. No there was no like WOW defense where clearly Chad didn't do it but there rarely can be with the case given and left to them by a guilty defendant. They didn't even throw Lori under the bus as much as some expected and I'd say that that was not unwise either because at any time in the future either one of these two could fully turn on the other and tell all.

Comparing Prior to the Delphi bozos leaves him in a damned good light. They tried the wow factor to a big to do but fizzle over time. They don't do their job, have never been up on their case or evidence, prepared for any court hearing and more so. Prior has handled this alone and it is a DP case on top of it. I don't like complimenting the man but honestly, he was prepared and knows his job and still has to do the death part once Chad is convicted which I trust he will be. Jmo.

He never seemed to seek fame with big blow out b.s. again like Delphi and in fact has been much maligned and criticized as defense attorneys naturally are.

It's interesting that though he had to handle this not death qualified, he now since he has handled one can easily get death penalty certified if he chooses to. I think that came from Nate some shows back.

Since it is nearing its end, and I may not get time, and I am a bit more in day off mode and had some rest now last night though never as much as I feel I need or hope to get lol, I want to say this as well. I've been critical of Boyce through the years and take none of it back because I felt it and still do accurate. He was a new judge with little experience or history when he got this case and it showed. I never understood it being left with him. And I feel he is responsible or more so than anyone with Lori getting the DP removed. HOWEVER over the course of these cases and his inexperience he has now been on the bench for what, five years or more? And I feel he has handled both trials very well and has used his time on the bench and gained knowledge and used his time and prepared for these trials and I don't see him as quite the inexperienced newbie I did. He still likes to take time to review and make a decision and so on but he can't a trial take weeks as he did with every motion to have a hearing to have another motion through the years of the cases before trial. He's done a good job imo. I don't take back my criticism but can acknowledge he isn't as green as he was and has done I think a very good job. No expert of course, just a citizen of the US following this case with an opinion. Before Lori's trial I was unsure he'd be able to rule on an objection quickly, where they have to, SERIOUSLY.

I think putting Chad's kids up was a big mistake but then what else did they really have? And I guess all these hints in various directions and the kids or Alex sneaking and doing this himself or Tammy's nutty way of not going to a doctor and giving percentages herself and using herbal or whatever medicines is all just an attempt for ONE jury to gain a hung jury in sympathy or belief. Because no way there will be any acquittal.

The kids did not help or didn't had I been a juror, they hindered and caused more reason to look at Chad and the control he has or why he would get his kids to lie for him or that they would choose to so corruptly do so, faith raised children, LYING.

Well they gave it a shot.

My prediction is guilty and we haven't heard the end yet. I also predict they won't be out long just as in Lori's although this is going to come up to the holiday weekend so it may be next week.

I of course work the entire holiday weekend but get an extra day's pay for working Monday. I work every weekend but you know what having Thurs and Fri off works for me. I get to see testimony, I get to make business calls, schedule doctor's appts and so on and those with only weekends off can't do that and it makes no difference in my life. There is almost never a reason I need a weekend off instead of my weekend of Thurs and Fri.

Today I am going to have it on as I think it will be interesting. I wouldn't doubt depending on point of finish that Boyce may call tomorrow off til Tuesday but I'd hope they finish it all from rebuttal to closing statements and THEN call it a week.

Even though we have Lori's AZ cases yet, it is going to be really weird when both these two big ones are put to bed. We've lived them for so many years, the murders of the children and of Tammy and the charges of both with this part.

There will likely never be another case like this one so big, convoluted, involving so many jurisdictions, people and murders. And I'd pray there won't be.

I do have some slim HOPE however some other charges will come down after against a few other players, if not multiple ones...

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Something else I have wanted to mention in watching Emma's testimony and it is kind of an odd one was her belief in NO ONE should ever be autopsied and she doesn't agree with it. Well sure I get it, NO one wants that done to a loved one's body but I guess she'd got without any cause of death when murder by anyone in this world or judge families that need answers if cause is not known or questioned?

However she also says in other testimony how one can laugh and not cry and so on in the LDS faith because this is just a break, they know the family including Chad and Tammy will all be together again one day, just a little break. I'm paraphrasing big time, but her basic intent/belief in my words. Well if you believe that then the body is but a vessel Emma.

Every single thing she said or made sure to get in in the practiced testimony was to get Chad off, explain something but then when having to explain something else in my opinion it contradicted big time. Not overtly so but any of us and most would pick up on such if listening to her.

Who wants an autopsy of a loved one? No one. However I am not going to judge families that feel the need to understand and in our case it wasn't an option or choice, and the alternative is to let a murderer go free first of all, and what had already been DONE to her body second of all shouldn't have been done by the perp.

Emma should have told the truth or stayed out of it and just let things take their course and justice result. Garth too imo. IF they are truly moral individuals. I have questions about that. Sorry but I do.

Never did finish Joseph Murray's testimony but would like to or would have liked to. He other than Garth and Emma only talked to Prior once like for five minutes or some such he says. Impressive so not coached right? But like he and Emma haven't talked of ALL all along, and Garth too no doubt.

Anyhow just sharing something that was in the actual testimony that I don't think is known or was in the Tweets. No autopsies should ever be done of anyone per Emma. yeah that would sure be nice so she'd have tons of criminals running free and does not think the body only a vessel and won't see her loved ones again and it is just a break?

I don't even have words for this uhm woman.

Guess Who · May 23, 2024

GrandmaBear said:
We have been there a million times and they are a drop in the bucket for a percentage to those that get it right. And its' always Casey and OJ, Case and OJ, now you add Durst. Same ones all of the time that EVERYONE in the nation cites because that''s about how rare it is. Two of these three were famous and Casey's case had flaws from the get go.

I'd also suspect less stupidity than influence or pay off and rigging.

Don't tell me to take nothing for granted, I don't compared to many for obvious reasons, a ton of them.

And no for the most part they aren't stupid. Those that are responsible, do not try to get out of serving and do their duty generally are committed, responsible, hard working people.

I'd also add that people on the trials you mentioned may have well wanted on the jury for other reasons like profiting and fame at the end of such trials.

You want to see what sounds like a NOT stupid jury, go listen to Nate and his juror interview. A very intelligent woman and it sounds like she was as impressed with the rest of the jurors as I was with her.

You're all wet here. Most juries are not stupid and most get it right every single day.

Your percentages in this are about the same as wrongful convictions these days compared to right ones.

And what I've heard the last few days from Nate is how attentive THIS jury is being.

I'm not going to argue more than this once a subject that's been beat to death and an argument which does not have enough of a basis or even a significant percentage to be argued.

I'd add that Durst and OJ were Los Angeles County, California, now THAT'S startling isn't it.... So few you ever name and two are in the same county. I mean wow what ARE the odds of that... Years apart but same county. Is it the ilk of juror that live there? Or something in the water.... Bribes? Bad prosecutors, dirty cops, what? Wannabe movie stars who can't go against someone of fame? Gee. I wonder.

I could maybe agree based on that perhaps that jurors in Los Angeles County are stupid or prosecutors are just bad or something.

Done with this as I'm not caught up on any case and I'm not going to waste more time on it.

Chad's going to be found guilty and may well get the DP. Can I know this, of course not but I have total faith in it. There will be NO acquittal, I will BET you, come on take me up on it, seriously.

My theory is that after a long trial, some juries just go with the easy out. They just want to go home and get back to their lives. Some people's jobs are in jeopardy with extended absence.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Guess Who said:
My theory is that after a long trial, some juries just go with the easy out. They just want to go home and get back to their lives. Some people's jobs are in jeopardy with extended absence.

I'm cynical as heck but I don't buy that when someone's life is in their hands. Do they want out and to go home, yes. Would it have me or you (I'd hope not) agreeing to let someone you believe to be a violent offender or risk to others go free OR convicting someone you did not feel guilty?? What you would do if a consensus can't be reached is keep going to the judge as a jury and saying a consensus can't be reached.

I do think there's a point though in talking of sequestered juries versus not sequestered and being able to handle home life a bit more and go home. I am a bit critical of times of judges cutting court for a day and giving a three day weekend or some such or cutting it early in the day BUT it probably DOES give jurors some time and breathing room to cope although cutting early or not doing a full week can also make the overall length longer.

AS far as easy outs, imo the jury that wants that would try in every way to get out of serving or being chosen to begin with. I think most that make it through are committed, know the length and know it isn't going to be easy. Jmo.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Cousin Dupree said:
It reminds me of Scientology, you're not allowed to read anything about me! They're all damned lies!!

I find a lot of comparisons with Scientology. Cults have many things in common.... And I'm also talking the LDS Church not just Chad and Lori's little clique. I will go there and will say it and that's how I see it. Jmo.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Guess Who said:
If you see a raccoon in the day, it's generally not good. They are typically either sick, have been uprooted from their dwelling and having to find a new home or can't find enough food during the nighttime.

I agree. Like I said I grew up seeing every critter at one point or another native to our area but never a raccoon except dead on the road, proof they were around. They are entirely nocturnal generally. Saw that baby and was the only one for me and that was at this last property of ours I still have so late in life. My brothers and dad had seen them at night or gotten a glimpse I'm sure taking out and burning garbage or some such as they did when we were kids. I never did though.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Kimster said:
I thought Garth was the youngest, too! Emma and Garth are proof that fathers can really influence their kids. I don’t know if they’ll wake up and smell the coffee someday, but they sure haven’t so far. I feel so bad for Tammy! I wonder if she had any idea what was happening or just going along with flow?

Agree totally.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Kimster said:
I was following the live tweets because I was doing a task at work. Then I heard the testimonies on Nate’s insider last night.

When he said that they were shooting raccoons in the middle of the night, I immediately thought about how that is so illegal here. It’s very dangerous to go shooting at night! You could kill someone walking around with a paintball or something.

There are things that are hunted at night where I live. Bobcats, coyotes, fox and raccoons speaking of raccoons. Many decades ago I had a boyfriend who would go out at night for bobcats.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

Kimster said:
I've wondered for months what Prior would be able to present to a jury that would create doubt in their minds. So far, he hasn't delivered. I don't even know why he's wasting the time, other than proving he presented a defense so Chad was represented.

I don't think either anything big has been delivered but I think they aimed for some doubts, reasonable doubt and hope to hit one juror at best. Doubt on Tammy per natural causes and doubt re kids as no absolute proof he laid a hand on them I guess. No jury is going to acquit him and I can only guess they hope he is found not guilty on one or another OR a hung jury results on one or all.

I agree but I mean what did Prior have to work with like most, a guilty client and a couple of kids who couldn't deliver the goods despite trying. Not kids but Chad's adult kids.

He DID put on a defense when compared to Archibald lol who was allowed to put on NONE.

Most defense attorneys have one big obstacle, most are representing guilty clients stupid enough to have a committed a crime and leaving a trail and evidence.

Prior did get some experts that are qualified and not fly by night paid whores it seems. Haven't heard all yet but one is up now.

GrandmaBear · May 23, 2024

This is bullsh*t:

9:31 a.m. Prior asks about someone dying from asphyxia from having someone else sit on their chest. Raven says it would be extraordinary difficult for a healthy person to die from having someone sit on their chest.

Trust me, I know. I won't go into how I know but I know. You put someone Chad's size kneeling on her chest and darned right it would cause death and instant distress. And this comes from a doctor. Smh.

JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell *GUILTY*

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JOSHUA "JJ" VALLOW, TYLEE RYAN, TAMMY DAYBELL, & CHARLES VALLOW: State of Idaho/Arizona vs. Lori & Chad Daybell GUILTY