Karen Read accused of backing into boyfriend and leaving him to die *MISTRIAL*

This woman didn't do this. I'd be willing to bet that someone in the house did it. Someone in the house looked up "How long will it take for somebody to die in the cold." Karen couldn't have done that search.

Is there a cover up conspiracy?

 

[GrandmaBear]

Karen jumped out of the car and immediately started doing CPR on John. When the EMT arrived she had his 'fresh' blood all over her. She first stated that he must have been hit by a snowplow driver.

Not one of the officers who lived in the residence where John died in front of came out of their home that day.

It was a nor'easter so, yes it was blizzard like conditions.

you mean the next day right? not the night she dropped him off...

I know about the people in the home not coming out, heard that on Melanie Little's videos...

Fresh blood makes me think he was recently alive or alive either way... In other words, he'd just been dumped when she went looking for him because that is when we are talking no?

I've heard different accounts of the "blizzard" depending on time and overall even. What I have heard is what makes me think they have never lived where I live and what we see although I will not complain about this winter.... Not going to jinx what has been a really good one.

It is kind of like talking where you guys get more ice than sn*w and so forth. You know winter better than say Florida but not necessarily the same although I"m sure you've had your samples as have we of more your kind.

I am open always to changing my mind and I'm not sold at all on any of it. So just to be clear you are talking the next morning when she had slept it off, he was missing, etc. right? Who is it that said it was fresh blood? I mean even if the other theory is true and he was dumped out in the blizzard, etc. did she find him the minute he had been and blood was still fresh? Not following that.... And I am seriously asking. How that is known and what the facts are.

I do not dispute the home owners did not come out. I also think as I said earlier they'd have wanted him dumped somewhere not near their residence.

I'm also not sure why she'd first state he must have been hit by a sn*wplow driver (I don't say the sn*w word, I don't want any or to ever jinx it lol). She well could have woken up and found him not there and had some memories coming back from the night before and hoped she was wrong... And found him exactly where she worried she would based on those fuzzy hung over thoughts...

I do think and agree that there is corrupt that want to use their power to convict one of their own. And that that alone is dirty.

For the record, my dad was a sn*wplow, grader, township driver for many years... Summer too... If it was a true blizzard well... This where I'd like to hear the testimony... They are plowing, they are not looking for bodies and even in this city here, on a day I have to drive three blocks to work when there has been a bit of cover, I have to watch out for trucks with plows backing up (private citizens), city trucks come wheeling and you name it. With a hardly significant sn*wfall in day time. Like little boys on a mission. My dad was not such and not saying this guy was but just saying that it doesn't mean much to me. Was he used to plowing and looking for people lying on the ground? Mailboxes, now that's another thing...

Some of this is an attempt at humor and I seriously am asking. Anyone dead or killed in a fight is going to have not fresh blood no? So did she go looking at the perfect time when the people framign her had just put his body out there? Fresh blood also implies living and not frozen by his blizzard...

So again just really asking. And I am open to it.

I do think they used their positions and power to make sure she goes down for his death. So I'm not entirely on a different page.

I will say this--let's say she did it but it is now shown how when those that be have not acted ethically and not abused their power and that can be shown, they ruined justice themselves. It doesn't pay to be dirty. Maybe it does for awhile until it comes home to roost amongst your own group and something happens.

I also mentioned earlier and I mean it, would John (do I have the name right) if another cop and the same alleged supposed thing happened have went along with framing his buddy's gif? Or go along with the bunch? And this would take a bunch.... Would he have been just as dirty? Would she keep her mouth shut if she was not being railroaded as they allegedly... If things fell on her side and she was cut a break for being a gf of a cop and part of the bunch....?

I honestly don't know but I think all of these things are food for thought and also reasons people in power or positions should maybe just stay home and drink if they are going to and not start at a bar power drinking, etc. like they are immune. I don't mean that in a victim blaming way but let's just admit that others see that and know that and know they have immunity. It all is great until something happens to one of their own.

I've seen it. Am guessing others have. In just about every community In America. And it goes on to this day.

A bit of a sidetrack sorry but just the whole scenario that night of course would have people that want to cover themselves because something happened in the midst of their privilege..

 

[kdg411]

you mean the next day right? not the night she dropped him off...

I know about the people in the home not coming out, heard that on Melanie Little's videos...

Fresh blood makes me think he was recently alive or alive either way... In other words, he'd just been dumped when she went looking for him because that is when we are talking no?

I've heard different accounts of the "blizzard" depending on time and overall even. What I have heard is what makes me think they have never lived where I live and what we see although I will not complain about this winter.... Not going to jinx what has been a really good one.

It is kind of like talking where you guys get more ice than sn*w and so forth. You know winter better than say Florida but not necessarily the same although I"m sure you've had your samples as have we of more your kind.

I am open always to changing my mind and I'm not sold at all on any of it. So just to be clear you are talking the next morning when she had slept it off, he was missing, etc. right? Who is it that said it was fresh blood? I mean even if the other theory is true and he was dumped out in the blizzard, etc. did she find him the minute he had been and blood was still fresh? Not following that.... And I am seriously asking. How that is known and what the facts are.

I do not dispute the home owners did not come out. I also think as I said earlier they'd have wanted him dumped somewhere not near their residence.

I'm also not sure why she'd first state he must have been hit by a sn*wplow driver (I don't say the sn*w word, I don't want any or to ever jinx it lol). She well could have woken up and found him not there and had some memories coming back from the night before and hoped she was wrong... And found him exactly where she worried she would based on those fuzzy hung over thoughts...

I do think and agree that there is corrupt that want to use their power to convict one of their own. And that that alone is dirty.

For the record, my dad was a sn*wplow, grader, township driver for many years... Summer too... If it was a true blizzard well... This where I'd like to hear the testimony... They are plowing, they are not looking for bodies and even in this city here, on a day I have to drive three blocks to work when there has been a bit of cover, I have to watch out for trucks with plows backing up (private citizens), city trucks come wheeling and you name it. With a hardly significant sn*wfall in day time. Like little boys on a mission. My dad was not such and not saying this guy was but just saying that it doesn't mean much to me. Was he used to plowing and looking for people lying on the ground? Mailboxes, now that's another thing...

Some of this is an attempt at humor and I seriously am asking. Anyone dead or killed in a fight is going to have not fresh blood no? So did she go looking at the perfect time when the people framign her had just put his body out there? Fresh blood also implies living and not frozen by his blizzard...

So again just really asking. And I am open to it.

I do think they used their positions and power to make sure she goes down for his death. So I'm not entirely on a different page.

I will say this--let's say she did it but it is now shown how when those that be have not acted ethically and not abused their power and that can be shown, they ruined justice themselves. It doesn't pay to be dirty. Maybe it does for awhile until it comes home to roost amongst your own group and something happens.

I also mentioned earlier and I mean it, would John (do I have the name right) if another cop and the same alleged supposed thing happened have went along with framing his buddy's gif? Or go along with the bunch? And this would take a bunch.... Would he have been just as dirty? Would she keep her mouth shut if she was not being railroaded as they allegedly... If things fell on her side and she was cut a break for being a gf of a cop and part of the bunch....?

I honestly don't know but I think all of these things are food for thought and also reasons people in power or positions should maybe just stay home and drink if they are going to and not start at a bar power drinking, etc. like they are immune. I don't mean that in a victim blaming way but let's just admit that others see that and know that and know they have immunity. It all is great until something happens to one of their own.

I've seen it. Am guessing others have. In just about every community In America. And it goes on to this day.

A bit of a sidetrack sorry but just the whole scenario that night of course would have people that want to cover themselves because something happened in the midst of their privilege..

Check out the following link which is verified and accurate with actual court filings that provide the details I mentioned.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Check out the following link which is verified and accurate with actual court filings that provide the details I mentioned.

I am up to 8:30 a.m and have to take a break and what I have read is more than I can process right now but I am not getting the picture I don't think that you have. I definitely see all the things re Jennifer McCabe. And I am not done yet and can't continue right now and ingest it.

What I sense so far is it was known he was hit when dropped off... No? They didn't realize this later, they knew or knew in short order?

Tell me your theory to help me here, especially re Jennifer..

I also see which I already knew that Karen was probably fairly plastered (drunk). And I see a number of people who feel immune drinking at two public bars and driving.

The entries of McCabe asking if he was there, etc. and then the entries of the party breaking up which differs a bit re interviews and more seem to indicate to me anyhow that they knew he was hit and had to figure out what to do..

Realize that I am looking at this with little bias or knowledge of all players. And it is what popped to me so far and I've read a ton, not all. I did wonder about Jennifer's closeness to John quite honestly once or twice.

A scenario comes to me that I don't think matches what some think. And that is that the party attendees or some knew he was hit early on but did not know what to do and did not call for help, worried naturally about other things, where it happened and near whose house and activities and partying and so on. This is what I'm seeing.

I do see the ton of J McCabe stuff. But I also see she was trying to determine when he would be there, if he had arrived and so on...

I may be all wet and totally wrong but realize I am looking at this with a blinder eye than others who have lived the case more, which would be with less bias and like a jury member should or would. I have watched a lot but not retained it all and it isn't one of my top ones, better recalled ones.

I haven't finished it but I still think yes there is big stink going on here but it isn't in the way of a fight and murder that way as to what happened.

Tell me if you would the support for that if any? Within what, an hour or less he enters the party (no proof he ever did is there?) and a physical altercation occurs that results in his death?

Some peoplet take me wrong and I am not arguing against you or anything like that, I truly enjoy the discussion and hard facts on cases and right now here, I have one to discuss that I don't know as well as you do.

PLUS I never get to discuss a case with you and I love that right out of the gate

 

[kdg411]

I am up to 8:30 a.m and have to take a break and what I have read is more than I can process right now but I am not getting the picture I don't think that you have. I definitely see all the things re Jennifer McCabe. And I am not done yet and can't continue right now and ingest it.

What I sense so far is it was known he was hit when dropped off... No? They didn't realize this later, they knew or knew in short order?

Tell me your theory to help me here, especially re Jennifer..

I also see which I already knew that Karen was probably fairly plastered (drunk). And I see a number of people who feel immune drinking at two public bars and driving.

The entries of McCabe asking if he was there, etc. and then the entries of the party breaking up which differs a bit re interviews and more seem to indicate to me anyhow that they knew he was hit and had to figure out what to do..

Realize that I am looking at this with little bias or knowledge of all players. And it is what popped to me so far and I've read a ton, not all. I did wonder about Jennifer's closeness to John quite honestly once or twice.

A scenario comes to me that I don't think matches what some think. And that is that the party attendees or some knew he was hit early on but did not know what to do and did not call for help, worried naturally about other things, where it happened and near whose house and activities and partying and so on. This is what I'm seeing.

I do see the ton of J McCabe stuff. But I also see she was trying to determine when he would be there, if he had arrived and so on...

I may be all wet and totally wrong but realize I am looking at this with a blinder eye than others who have lived the case more, which would be with less bias and like a jury member should or would. I have watched a lot but not retained it all and it isn't one of my top ones, better recalled ones.

I haven't finished it but I still think yes there is big stink going on here but it isn't in the way of a fight and murder that way as to what happened.

Tell me if you would the support for that if any? Within what, an hour or less he enters the party (no proof he ever did is there?) and a physical altercation occurs that results in his death?

Some peoplet take me wrong and I am not arguing against you or anything like that, I truly enjoy the discussion and hard facts on cases and right now here, I have one to discuss that I don't know as well as you do.

PLUS I never get to discuss a case with you and I love that right out of the gate

This is one of the rare no child victim cases that I've been following very closely. I know you're not arguing so no worries. If you get a chance to review that spreadsheet from twitter I posted it details the facts only and I suggest start there. MSM is not a finder of fact, especially in this case.

From the facts only, my opinion is that John was beaten inside that house and was dumped by the curb. If Karen did hit him, how did he make it from the driveway where he was dropped off to the opposite side of yard by the street on top of all the snow and not under it? Just questions to consider.

 

[GrandmaBear]

This is one of the rare no child victim cases that I've been following very closely. I know you're not arguing so no worries. If you get a chance to review that spreadsheet from twitter I posted it details the facts only and I suggest start there. MSM is not a finder of fact, especially in this case.

From the facts only, my opinion is that John was beaten inside that house and was dumped by the curb. If Karen did hit him, how did he make it from the driveway where he was dropped off to the opposite side of yard by the street on top of all the snow and not under it? Just questions to consider.

Good to see you on one and following one and commenting.

I know you know I am not arguing lol but want to ensure that anyhow.

If you mean the sheet with all the dates and time entries I did read a ton of it but just couldn't finish all right now.

I don't listen to or buy MSM in any cases. MSM is not something I follow for any reason or I should say there is no reason to ever imo.

I value your opinion and especially if one you have followed closely and I haven't so that holds a lot of weight with me right there.

I would admittedly have to go back to see some details like what you say about making it from driveway elsewhere and I think I did hear a lot of this but it is not a top case of mine and I don't listen to as closely or retain it as well as I haven't invested in it so to speak where I watch all on it and so on like some cases.

I take your word as to facts, with some I won't as they put things out that aren't facts as I've seen just this week. I'll leave the person unnamed but I think most know who and in what cases.

So why was he beaten and by who in your opinion? Just a drunken brawl? A preplanned thing because he ratted on some other cop or more than one or something? Did one or all have it in for him and as I asked before intend to frame he as well? This is where it kind of falls down for me. Even if she didn't hit him, not sure I buy this happened either.

It doesn't make someone guilty but it doesn't help that most all including Karen were drinking, driving and being total hypocrites. And doing so publicly.

There is a lot to wonder about here I will admit that but again it all seemed to come about when she realized she was not going to get off lightly but going to face harsh charges. That much I recall and some bit more.

The STS episode I posted some ways back was the first I watched fully on it probably and it was something else. There was a woman on it who was on the side of the prosecution and she interrupted everyone constantly and was annoying but it was interesting as all heck and fiery. As much as she irritated the HECK out of me she made REALLY GOOD points. If you haven't watched that, I'd recommend it as it is not dull. You will hate her for her behavior but stick it out and hear them all and yes, there were at least two others on the side of the fence you are on. Again it is not dul or hard to each although you may want to throw something at her a couple of times for her overtaking and rudeness. She just for one has no patience with the b.s. lol. B.S. in her opinion.

In this case, I wouldn't have a problem with all charges dropped and the prosecution trying to not put their tail between their legs even though I am pro victim always. They all need to quit imo. I'm also sorry to say I don't care as much about it as some because of some reasons mentioned.

Here's another question that also goes with was this fight just a drunken brawl or planned--how could anyone know she'd drop him off to be able to frame her? How did anyone know she did and hadn't driven himself, etc.? Were they all watching out the windows for him and her? I just can't quite see answers to some very logical questions or I guess have a ton of them.

If true, his making it from one spot to another I guess could mean he was not immediately dead. Also as far as that and as to him being on top of the sn*w, I believe I've heard varying things on both of those things but can't recall them.

I appreciate your opinion on it and even yield to it as you know it more. I don't yield to emu's as he thinks everyone wrongly charged and convicted which honestly doesn't help with me buying this one or yet another of his. Honestly I have ten percent doubt off the top when he says such because he always jumps to such TOO much. Not everyone in the system is corrupts nor every office nor is every defendant innocent and wrongly charged.

I don't know that I will get back to finishing that spreadsheet but I read a ton of it. I haven't got anything done I should have today so have to get on it.

I guess one final thing is even if she didn't do it, I certainly haven't seen anything showing the other claim of a fight either. More supporting that, the why, the who, etc. I'd be interested in. Maybe I have heard and don't recall but I don't think so. If I had seen enough reason or weight to think that likely my opinion would be more on the fence or the other way I think.

 

[Summer_Breeze]

Attorneys in Karen Read murder case argue motions to dismiss charges, disqualify DA

The Karen Read murder trial is scheduled to begin next month, but an important hearing was held in the case on Tuesday that could affect the trajectory of the trial. Read — accused of killing John O’Keefe, her Boston police officer boyfriend, in Canton, Massachusetts, in 2022 — last appeared in...

www.nbcboston.com

By Marc Fortier and Asher Klein • Published 25 mins ago • Updated 25 mins ago​

The Karen Read murder trial was previously scheduled to begin Tuesday before it was delayed by at least a month, but there will be a motion hearing in the case today.

Read — who is accused of killing her Boston police officer boyfriend in Canton, Massachusetts, back in 2022 — was in court for the hearing on Feb. 26 when Norfolk Superior Court Judge Beverly Cannone set a new trial date of April 16 after thousands of pages of new evidence was received from the U.S. Attorney's Office for Massachusetts.

It wasn't immediately clear if Read would be in court for Tuesday's hearing.

Read's attorneys previously said they would likely need more time to comb through all 3,074 pages of evidence they received from federal prosecutors, and with a separate legal process to go through in the federal court system.

"An April 16 jury trial is not realistic," attorney Alan Jackson said.

Cannone said she understood his position, but advised him to be ready for trial regardless.

While Jackson characterized the new evidence his team had time to review as being exculpatory for Read, and entirely new, prosecutor Laura McLaughlin disputed that characterization, saying that at least 90% of the evidence is consistent with prior testimony in the case.

Documents indicate that a piece of O'Keefe's hair and pieces of the glass from the drink he was carrying were found stuck under Read's SUV. The documents also paint a picture of relationship turmoil. They say Read was angry at O'Keefe for allegedly cheating on her.

 

[kdg411]

Motions Hearing in Karen Read Case Alleges 'Significant Relationships'

Defense attorney Alan Jackson ticked off several examples of what he described as knowing 'distortions' of evidence.

www.courttv.com

Per the FBI DOJ report, the injuries John O'Keefe sustained did not come from Karen Read's SUV.

 

[Summer_Breeze]

Lead detective in Karen Read murder case under investigation

A trooper who handled key evidence and witnesses in the murder case against Karen Read is now the subject of an internal investigation by Massachusetts State Police. State police confirmed Wednesday that Michael Proctor is being investigated for a potential violation of department policy but...

www.necn.com

By Alysha Palumbo • Published March 14, 2024 • Updated 3 hours ago​

A trooper who handled key evidence and witnesses in the murder case against Karen Read is now the subject of an internal investigation by Massachusetts State Police.

State police confirmed Wednesday that Michael Proctor is being investigated for a potential violation of department policy but they would not comment on what caused them to probe one of their own.

Proctor was one of the investigators in the case against Read, who is charged with second-degree murder in the 2022 death of her boyfriend, Boston Police Officer John O'Keefe, in Canton.

Prosecutors allege that Read hit O'Keefe with her SUV and left him to die, while Read's defense attorneys have long claimed she is being framed in a wide-ranging coverup.


It wasn't immediately clear if this internal investigation could have any bearing on the Read case, but it did come to light just one day after a bombshell hearing in Read's murder trial in which her defense attorney alleged Proctor never fully disclosed his personal relationship with multiple people involved in the case. This includes the Albert family, who lived at the home on the property where O’Keefe’s body was found.

Texts allegedly show the Alberts offered to send Proctor a thank you gift “when this is all over,” and just days prior to O’Keefe’s death, Proctor had allegedly asked the Alberts to babysit his child.

“So now we have the lead investigator from Massachusetts State Police literally discussing the exchange of gifts between the Albert family on one hand, and the Proctor family on the other hand, as a thank you -- their words -- for helping the Alberts out of a jam," Alan Jackson, one of Read's defense attorneys, said in court Tuesday.

 

[GrandmaBear]

He should be investigated, I wholeheartedly agree with that part. Cops and officials and anyone in power and for goodness sakes almost all politicians as well should keep their sh*t clean because even if they are charging right or representing right (not saying that is the case here don't know) this sh*t can come back at them in the way of "how can you believe anything this guy says did or that anyone he charges isn't some corrupt bunch of b.s."...

Wide ranging conspiracies though against someone like her and something like this are a big thing to swallow.

I'll go back to again even Karen and her bf were doing what they'd arrest other citizens for, most of them were. That doesn't make them exactly pure as the driven sn*w either.

I'm open, I'm not sold in either direction but yes, any official, etc. that's been dirty in their position should darned well be invesitgated, it doesn't mean the case here isn't legit but look at what it can do to such.

I do love the example being made in the sense that people with power better shape up as the times and things that can be found out and shared have changed big time.

The web search by Jen McCabe depending on time and date may be big but if it was before, then why hasn't that been used by now...

I agree though with investigating and getting rid of those who are dirty and abuse their power. Wholeheartedly.

 

[kdg411]

He should be investigated, I wholeheartedly agree with that part. Cops and officials and anyone in power and for goodness sakes almost all politicians as well should keep their sh*t clean because even if they are charging right or representing right (not saying that is the case here don't know) this sh*t can come back at them in the way of "how can you believe anything this guy says did or that anyone he charges isn't some corrupt bunch of b.s."...

Wide ranging conspiracies though against someone like her and something like this are a big thing to swallow.

I'll go back to again even Karen and her bf were doing what they'd arrest other citizens for, most of them were. That doesn't make them exactly pure as the driven sn*w either.

I'm open, I'm not sold in either direction but yes, any official, etc. that's been dirty in their position should darned well be invesitgated, it doesn't mean the case here isn't legit but look at what it can do to such.

I do love the example being made in the sense that people with power better shape up as the times and things that can be found out and shared have changed big time.

The web search by Jen McCabe depending on time and date may be big but if it was before, then why hasn't that been used by now...

I agree though with investigating and getting rid of those who are dirty and abuse their power. Wholeheartedly.

The FBI was investigating the corruption by this law enforcement agecy long before John was murdered. Karen Read didn't hit John & drive off. No motive, means or opportunity. I hope John's family gets the justice for their loved one but it's not Karen Read that was charged.

 

[GrandmaBear]

The FBI was investigating the corruption by this law enforcement agecy long before John was murdered. Karen Read didn't hit John & drive off. No motive, means or opportunity. I hope John's family gets the justice for their loved one but it's not Karen Read that was charged.

I'm certainly not going to argue as you've followed it as a top case for you probably and I haevn't but I have seen a lot. And I have total respect for your opinion and see all the reasons for it.

I just have trouble swallowing just a bit too many things that have to be explained. I'm certainly not even 60 percent plus in one direction.

Not only would the corrupt agency being investigated before have to have it in for John for some reason and kill him themselves, they'd then have to plan to frame her for it and a whole host of other things. All evidence would have to be planted or lack of it would have to be intentional by far more than just one guy or even the local agency including labs, medical examiners and more. There is always the thing in such cases too that can't be taken away and that is that she DID drop him off AND did NOT attend with him, imagine if they'd just went home together. They didn't PLACE her there (cap letters are not at you of course, just emphasis), and they didn't make her leave him off alone. They didn't make either of them drink and more. Some very unfortunate circumstances but they also make the likelihood of her having done this very likely. Imo anyhow. So then they took advantage of all this (they couldn't have known they'd be not getting along or her not coming and more could they) and planned this? If not, then just happenstance a fight happened to erupt where John was killed? For me that's a whole lot of unlikelihoods.

I believe very much in the likely corrupt people here but it doesn't mean they framed her, what it does mean imo because their sh*t does stink, it can be used to doubt a thing about something that probably truly did happen.

They had to have had it in for her or him and have some reason imo and the other is this fight that just was never planned occurred and he was killed. There would have to be more to it imo.

I do believe the corruption and know the feds were investigating prior. It would make more sense to me if those saying Read didn't do this were saying John and her were ratting or he was about corruption in the department... Even then it would take many but such could happen as in Murdaugh. I don't think they will ever charge the tip of the iceberg there with the corrupt that either kept their mouths shut, fell in line or made decisions or helped anything the "powers that be" (Murdaughs, etc.) did or wanted or expected.

I find the discussion interesting and enjoy it. And she and her defense have done a bang up job of creating a LOT of doubt. And perhaps she is innocent. I did catch a part of something the other day though as to why she isn't... Haven't had time to watch much of anything on the hearing the other day either.

Did noting come out of it other than what was said here? I do know judge didn't make a decision on either thing, that's about all I know...

I'd think this on both sides has hopefully accomplished this much--and that is that LE and gfs and powers that be aren't drinking at local establishments and the annual party has ended...

Again I do entirely agree with outing the corrupt and any investigation into such. And I'm not sold or vehement in a high percentage way either.

Also, I enjoy the discussion, I love discussion even if not with the same leanings.

 

[kdg411]

I'm certainly not going to argue as you've followed it as a top case for you probably and I haevn't but I have seen a lot. And I have total respect for your opinion and see all the reasons for it.

I just have trouble swallowing just a bit too many things that have to be explained. I'm certainly not even 60 percent plus in one direction.

Not only would the corrupt agency being investigated before have to have it in for John for some reason and kill him themselves, they'd then have to plan to frame her for it and a whole host of other things. All evidence would have to be planted or lack of it would have to be intentional by far more than just one guy or even the local agency including labs, medical examiners and more. There is always the thing in such cases too that can't be taken away and that is that she DID drop him off AND did NOT attend with him, imagine if they'd just went home together. They didn't PLACE her there (cap letters are not at you of course, just emphasis), and they didn't make her leave him off alone. They didn't make either of them drink and more. Some very unfortunate circumstances but they also make the likelihood of her having done this very likely. Imo anyhow. So then they took advantage of all this (they couldn't have known they'd be not getting along or her not coming and more could they) and planned this? If not, then just happenstance a fight happened to erupt where John was killed? For me that's a whole lot of unlikelihoods.

I believe very much in the likely corrupt people here but it doesn't mean they framed her, what it does mean imo because their sh*t does stink, it can be used to doubt a thing about something that probably truly did happen.

They had to have had it in for her or him and have some reason imo and the other is this fight that just was never planned occurred and he was killed. There would have to be more to it imo.

I do believe the corruption and know the feds were investigating prior. It would make more sense to me if those saying Read didn't do this were saying John and her were ratting or he was about corruption in the department... Even then it would take many but such could happen as in Murdaugh. I don't think they will ever charge the tip of the iceberg there with the corrupt that either kept their mouths shut, fell in line or made decisions or helped anything the "powers that be" (Murdaughs, etc.) did or wanted or expected.

I find the discussion interesting and enjoy it. And she and her defense have done a bang up job of creating a LOT of doubt. And perhaps she is innocent. I did catch a part of something the other day though as to why she isn't... Haven't had time to watch much of anything on the hearing the other day either.

Did noting come out of it other than what was said here? I do know judge didn't make a decision on either thing, that's about all I know...

I'd think this on both sides has hopefully accomplished this much--and that is that LE and gfs and powers that be aren't drinking at local establishments and the annual party has ended...

Again I do entirely agree with outing the corrupt and any investigation into such. And I'm not sold or vehement in a high percentage way either.

Also, I enjoy the discussion, I love discussion even if not with the same leanings.

I enjoy discussing a case that doesn't involve children. It's easier on my mental health. I'm glad to see your interest in it as well.

You've mentioned, a couple of times, about why was Karen setup and I'm going to take a deeper dive into that. I'd prefer to provide facts so I will get back to you regarding this.

If there are any other questions that you have just let me know. This case is has divided many and I don't want to push any narrative just the evidence that has been presented in the formal documents thru the court.

 

[GrandmaBear]

It IS a reason why any one who wants to go into LE, judgeship, politics, etc. maybe better think about keeping their nose clean. Not like that will ever happen but we are seeing a lot more called out and I'd suspect there are still some dumb ones but many watch and think OMG if I get attention called to myself over some case and they start looking at me and even my per diem or car records.... I've not been above board and I better clean up my act and HOPE nothing like this happens to me because I've been screwing the chief's wife, I made sure an arrest my son had disappeared or a police report did, etc., etc., etc. And worse because I know things and took favors, I don't DARE rat on the person...

Yeah, I don't have trouble believing some of that part of things. I just don't think it means this isn't what happened. I'm also not sure what I think of the almost cult like following of Karen. Calling tings out is great but again she was still drinking and driving, dropped him off, went home and thought when told that she had done it if I have that right? She isn'\t an idol and the victim wasn't most likely just as much as some of the others here. I'm victim first but it doesn't mean the victim is always an innocent nor is every accused, even if accused by those not Lily white and abusive of their position themselves. Jmo.

 

[GrandmaBear]

I enjoy discussing a case that doesn't involve children. It's easier on my mental health. I'm glad to see your interest in it as well.

You've mentioned, a couple of times, about why was Karen setup and I'm going to take a deeper dive into that. I'd prefer to provide facts so I will get back to you regarding this.

If there are any other questions that you have just let me know. This case is has divided many and I don't want to push any narrative just the evidence that has been presented in the formal documents thru the court.

Don't do a deep dive for me, or spend your time for me or that reason. I certainly agree on the cases with children aspect. I follow plenty of adult, for instance, Morphew is a pet one and always has been. They are easier which sounds wrong, I certainly don't mean it that way, but an adult at least has had a chance at life, children haven't, right?

The case does seem to have divided and Delphi is another that way. Emotions take over I guess. Or the long investment in such cases. I definitely have emotion in all cases but it isn't what forms my opinions. It does form what I hope ONCE I see or something makes me believe one is guilty, especially of a child crime, my opinion on what should happen to them. Then yes, emotion does play in.

I'm just happy to see you

And love that you know I am just discussing. I just don't see the alternate story here which didn't even get suggested as far as I've heard until she realized she was going to be charged pretty harshly. As I said, it would take a lot of dots and dots that don't all connect and too many things imo to be explained away.

Calling out corruption I love, but I don't see the woman as some icon as some seem to out there. We all make mistakes and haven't lived perfect lives but this was a drinking drunk night and there's little doubt about that and they're officers, and their gfs, wives and others in positions of power.

I WILL temper that by saying if she is innocent and knows she is, I fully admire the fighting back, the fighting the corruption and the fighting the framing and standing up to it all. But my first knowledge of this case was that she believed she very well did or could have hit him and that sticks with me and is a big part of things.

As I also said it would take a med examiner as to cause of death and injuries, a lab and so many involved and people call some conspiracy theorists well this would be a huge one...

I also don't think either side is going to back down at this point and will let the sh*t roll. Not sure about the one(s) under investigation but the others yeah they feel they have a case.

I will also concede a few other things. The dog thing is a bit interesting but I just a day or two ago saw the marks on was it his arm...? And that doesn't seem to explain those either...And here is where autopsy comes in...

Again I don't know it as well as you but have heard and seen quite a lot.

I guess it could be looked at too that every person charged and convicted by who seems to be dirty or corrupt should be released. That's not sarcasm, what I mean is that their abuse of power doesn't mean no one was ever accused and convicted that was not guilty.

I don't know. I really don't.

What I do know is I enjoy such discussions and miss such and don't find them often and I don't mean here, I mean in life even and not just with crime.

 

[kdg411]

The Karen Read Canton Case: The Killing That Tore a Town Apart

Inside the simmering tabloid drama dividing this tight-knit Mass. suburb.

www.bostonmagazine.com

It wasn’t long before a far more sinister theory of what happened began to emerge. On his drive home after the arraignment, Yannetti says, he returned a call to a tipster who had previously called his office. A man with a gravelly voice—who initially offered up a fake name—picked up the phone and told Yannetti, he recalls, something to the effect of, “Your client is innocent. John was beaten up by Brian Albert and his nephew. They broke his nose, and when O’Keefe didn’t come to, Brian and a federal agent dumped his body on the front lawn.”

 

[GrandmaBear]

The Karen Read Canton Case: The Killing That Tore a Town Apart

Inside the simmering tabloid drama dividing this tight-knit Mass. suburb.

www.bostonmagazine.com

It wasn’t long before a far more sinister theory of what happened began to emerge. On his drive home after the arraignment, Yannetti says, he returned a call to a tipster who had previously called his office. A man with a gravelly voice—who initially offered up a fake name—picked up the phone and told Yannetti, he recalls, something to the effect of, “Your client is innocent. John was beaten up by Brian Albert and his nephew. They broke his nose, and when O’Keefe didn’t come to, Brian and a federal agent dumped his body on the front lawn.”

Wow that was a long, long, long read. I feel as if I left the planet for awhile. I had thoughts from early in it and my meter changed some as to guilt or innocene but by the time I got done it changed again an I am lucky if I can recall all.

I do recall the first thing that struck me and that's that Karen had people over for dinner who were witnesses at GJ and/or told her about GJ stuff. NOT okay.

But then as it went on, I tipped a bit the other way.

Then as it went on further I went back.

The ending pages though tipped me back to where I'm at with it. Maybe even more strongly than I was. There was stuff throughout on both sides I had comments on but it was so long they don't come to mind easily as I had so many.

I went one way and then back, etc., etc. and I ended up back to she killed him.

She called or texted him like 50 times that night? Pieces of tail light or whatever were embedded in is flesh? They'd resisted LE taking her phone as to her whereabouts and such? I also found it interesting she woke up the niece, panicked called the very people she is against now to help her find him (all of this I am pretty sure I knew before) and of course she spotted him right off.

This was one HE77 of an interesting read although the longest I have maybe done in some time but all interesting. I know of Turtleboy and more but have forgotten some and it refreshed me.

I wavered on a part or two of it but came back even more strongly in thinking she did it it by the end.

But I was open and still am and did waver.

There's just too much that each thing needs an explanation for.

I do believe they are local corrupt on occasion cops etc. for their own sakes and benefit.

I do believe however she did this. And possibly intentionally.

There's GPS showing her reversing at a high rate of speed. I knew that but had forgotten. And so much more.

I said earlier I saw a bit on this on a show the other night or so and a guest was going on about if this gets to trial the sheer forenisics and evidence they have.

I want to be agreeable and I did waver during reading it to more of a 50/50 but by the end, I was more solid in that she killed him.d

And she has a "romantic" partner who was at the party/in the home as well?

I think as I said prior there are good old boys abusing their positions, etc. but it doesn't mean anyone is charged wrong here. This case should go to a jury for one just to see what a jury of us/our peers will find. I was leaning the other way a bit until the end which refreshed me on what led me to my opinion and even added to it.

She's done though a bang up job of using the internet and getting a lawyer with an email with a subject line interesting enough to catch attention.

I did waiver, seriously through this long article and even go a bit the other way, until I finally saw all and finished it.

I will say again though when cops, mayors, people in power, politicians are crooked even if just on their own behalf they don't help justice when they charge someone rightfully because they can be impeached just from their own shenannigans that may not even relate.

In our case, one of the key inestigators the defense tried to impeach on the stand due to something prior, noting to do with our case. Believe me what it was was not something I would endorse--he and another had been heard on bodycam or some such (forgot?) talking about the people in the case they were on or whose house they were in or something like that. It was publicly known a few years prior. YEAH, not wise, and not smart but I talked to that same investigator for years and he was smart and committed to justice. Intelligent as all HE77. The thing that the defense attys tried to use was more work talk, disillusion with people they had to deal with and pay grade for what they did and such. Didn't work.

I know it isn't the same but a corrupt DA or anything here does not mean Karen is innocent. And even in this article it says what a sheer conspiracy it would take.

I'm also going to say I wouldn't want her to become the poster girl/woman for anyone, especially some youth.

So it also refreshed me on she called Jen McCabe....

It also may be minor but she allegedly awoke and was panicked he wasn't there. Why? He's a cop. And apparently perhaps both were cheating on each other.

This was quite the article and I thought of so many things but the length of it has me beyond where I can hit each one and some are on her behalf or were until I finished it.

A great read though.

 

[kdg411]

Wow that was a long, long, long read. I feel as if I left the planet for awhile. I had thoughts from early in it and my meter changed some as to guilt or innocene but by the time I got done it changed again an I am lucky if I can recall all.

I do recall the first thing that struck me and that's that Karen had people over for dinner who were witnesses at GJ and/or told her about GJ stuff. NOT okay.

But then as it went on, I tipped a bit the other way.

Then as it went on further I went back.

The ending pages though tipped me back to where I'm at with it. Maybe even more strongly than I was. There was stuff throughout on both sides I had comments on but it was so long they don't come to mind easily as I had so many.

I went one way and then back, etc., etc. and I ended up back to she killed him.

She called or texted him like 50 times that night? Pieces of tail light or whatever were embedded in is flesh? They'd resisted LE taking her phone as to her whereabouts and such? I also found it interesting she woke up the niece, panicked called the very people she is against now to help her find him (all of this I am pretty sure I knew before) and of course she spotted him right off.

This was one HE77 of an interesting read although the longest I have maybe done in some time but all interesting. I know of Turtleboy and more but have forgotten some and it refreshed me.

I wavered on a part or two of it but came back even more strongly in thinking she did it it by the end.

But I was open and still am and did waver.

There's just too much that each thing needs an explanation for.

I do believe they are local corrupt on occasion cops etc. for their own sakes and benefit.

I do believe however she did this. And possibly intentionally.

There's GPS showing her reversing at a high rate of speed. I knew that but had forgotten. And so much more.

I said earlier I saw a bit on this on a show the other night or so and a guest was going on about if this gets to trial the sheer forenisics and evidence they have.

I want to be agreeable and I did waver during reading it to more of a 50/50 but by the end, I was more solid in that she killed him.d

And she has a "romantic" partner who was at the party/in the home as well?

I think as I said prior there are good old boys abusing their positions, etc. but it doesn't mean anyone is charged wrong here. This case should go to a jury for one just to see what a jury of us/our peers will find. I was leaning the other way a bit until the end which refreshed me on what led me to my opinion and even added to it.

She's done though a bang up job of using the internet and getting a lawyer with an email with a subject line interesting enough to catch attention.

I did waiver, seriously through this long article and even go a bit the other way, until I finally saw all and finished it.

I will say again though when cops, mayors, people in power, politicians are crooked even if just on their own behalf they don't help justice when they charge someone rightfully because they can be impeached just from their own shenannigans that may not even relate.

In our case, one of the key inestigators the defense tried to impeach on the stand due to something prior, noting to do with our case. Believe me what it was was not something I would endorse--he and another had been heard on bodycam or some such (forgot?) talking about the people in the case they were on or whose house they were in or something like that. It was publicly known a few years prior. YEAH, not wise, and not smart but I talked to that same investigator for years and he was smart and committed to justice. Intelligent as all HE77. The thing that the defense attys tried to use was more work talk, disillusion with people they had to deal with and pay grade for what they did and such. Didn't work.

I know it isn't the same but a corrupt DA or anything here does not mean Karen is innocent. And even in this article it says what a sheer conspiracy it would take.

I'm also going to say I wouldn't want her to become the poster girl/woman for anyone, especially some youth.

So it also refreshed me on she called Jen McCabe....

It also may be minor but she allegedly awoke and was panicked he wasn't there. Why? He's a cop. And apparently perhaps both were cheating on each other.

This was quite the article and I thought of so many things but the length of it has me beyond where I can hit each one and some are on her behalf or were until I finished it.

A great read though.

It is a long read however it laid things out.

The person who had the most 'beef' with John at that party was Brian Albert. He is a Boston police officer & a trained MMA fighter. Their feud was simply because John stayed on the right side of the law. The injuries to John are not supported as a vehicular accident. He was beaten. Karen is being set up because one of Boston's 'finest' couldn't be implicated in a murder.

Just let that sink in. Oh, and remember the FBI already concluded that John's death was not due to accident from a vehicle.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

It is a long read however it laid things out.

The person who had the most 'beef' with John at that party was Brian Albert. He is a Boston police officer & a trained MMA fighter. Their feud was simply because John stayed on the right side of the law. The injuries to John are not supported as a vehicular accident. He was beaten. Karen is being set up because one of Boston's 'finest' couldn't be implicated in a murder.

Just let that sink in. Oh, and remember the FBI already concluded that John's death was not due to accident from a vehicle.

OOOOHHHHHH!!! This is getting good. I hope they root out a lot of bad apples and expose the corruption that I think is in a lot more police forces than we think.

 

[GrandmaBear]

It is a long read however it laid things out.

The person who had the most 'beef' with John at that party was Brian Albert. He is a Boston police officer & a trained MMA fighter. Their feud was simply because John stayed on the right side of the law. The injuries to John are not supported as a vehicular accident. He was beaten. Karen is being set up because one of Boston's 'finest' couldn't be implicated in a murder.

Just let that sink in. Oh, and remember the FBI already concluded that John's death was not due to accident from a vehicle.

As I said I forgot a lot of thoughts by the time I read it all and from this fact to that fact etc. One is that the black eyes stand out IF fact. That does not sound vehicular.

I agree also it is very, very long but covers it pretty much.

The Albert thing though they said he left and there's proof of it or wasn't there when John was etc. no? And was that Brian or Colin, again the length and my day and this not being my top case has me a bit fuzzy but I did read it all and did have a ton of thoughts. I looked at the link and read every bit.

I can see a set up if one of the "finest" could be implicated but I still have some issues with that. For instance, they all knew she dropped him off? Just for starters... And was it planned and him intended to be killed and set up or did I just happen and then they framed her? And I could go on from there and what it would take but won't.

I thought it was the DOJ that said not due to an accident.

If I'm honest, I don't think much of any of these people. They are what most of us dislike, thinking they are immune and that includes the defendant who I think perhaps thought she would be but then found out not.

They were all (or most) doing what they'd put the rest of us away for. At least as far as those that drank and drove and do so n front of the rest of the public (with their bar attendance).

As I always say I am victim first and I am. That doesn't mean though family or gf who are victims of the loss or victim him or herself can't play in.

I think it's great if the dirty gets called out there and cleared up but I'm not sure that means she did not do this. And if she did, then look at the almost idolization she's received from it. And there was plenty in that long read too that makes her extremely questionable. I almost get the feeling she thought Jen McCabe would be on her side or that one knew... And then as people who abuse their power, position or those they know get it turned around on them...

He deserves justice. He's a victim. I used to think both sides should lie down some and make a deal but the article actually made me a bit stronger and the bit I heard the other night did as well in that let a jury decide AND LET them hear ALL the evidence. I heard there is plenty of it and even this article said tail light was embedded in his skin. TAht would take one heck of a conspiracy.

It can't be undone but they should have just stayed home. That isn't victim blaming, it's just a point of but for one change imaybe the evening wouldn't have ended in a fatal evening... Drank at home if wanted and had people over to their house if wanted.

I guess for me it'\s like Hollywood stuff and celebrities. It's all great between all until one turns on another or something happens, until then all are buddies and feel immune.

That just triggered something that I forgot. As I said when I read that article many thoughts came to mind but by the end I couildn't recall all because it was long. So her atty represented Harvey Weinstein I think I read.

Speaking of celebrities or people with power.

Again I enjoy the discussion VERY MUCH.

 

[Summer_Breeze]

Howie Carr's recent take on this case. It is rather blunt. (Boston area reporter) Fairly long article.

Howie Carr: Karen Read case new trooper curveball

the case against Karen Read was unraveling before Tuesday. But that day, parts of the sealed feds’ report concerning possible prosecutorial abuse were put into the record. It was put together by th…

www.bostonherald.com

By HOWIE CARR | howard.carr@medianewsgroup.com | Boston Herald
March 15, 2024 at 6:06 a.m.