LIBBY GERMAN & ABBY WILLIAMS: Indiana vs. Richard Allen for 2017 murder of two Delphi girls *TRIAL IN PROGRESS*

On February 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams and Liberty German were discovered near the Monon High Bridge Trail, which is part of the Delphi Historic Trails in Delphi, Indiana, United States, after the young girls had disappeared from the same trail the previous day. The murders have received significant media coverage because a photo and audio recording of an individual believed to be the girls' murderer was found on German's smartphone. Despite the audio and video recordings of the suspect that have been circulated and the more than 26,000 tips that police have received, no arrest in the case has been made.[1][2][3]



Police have not publicly stated nor released details of how the girls were murdered.[6] As early as February 15, 2017, Indiana State Police began circulating a still image of an individual reportedly seen on the Monon High Bridge Trail near where the two friends were slain; the grainy photograph appearing to capture a Caucasian male, with hands in pockets, walking on the rail bridge, head down, toward the girls.[4] A few days later, the person in the photograph was named the prime suspect in the double-homicide.[5]

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant,[7] though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." It was at this news conference that officials credited the source of the audio and imagery to German's smartphone, and, further, regarded her as a hero for having had the uncanny foresight and fortitude to record the exchange in secret. Police indicated that additional evidence from the phone had been secured, but that they did not release it so as not to "compromise any future trial." By this time, the reward offered in the case was set at $41,000.[5]

Murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

On Feb 14, 2017, the bodies of Abigail Williams & Liberty German were discovered in Delphi, #INDIANA. The suspect in their deaths is awaiting trial.

On February 22, law enforcement released an audio recording where the voice of the assailant, though in some degree muffled, is heard to say, "Down the hill." Even with a lot of media coverage, their murders remain unsolved.

www.crimewatchers.net

 

[Tresir]

You seem to believe that it doesn't take long to build a case against someone. How did LISK and other serial killers get away with it for so long? DAs will frustrate the Police by turning down the prosecution of a suspect because they don't have enough evidence yet. They have to get enough evidence that a DA feels confident will lead to a conviction.

So someone other than RA left DNA and fingerprints at the crime scene, and yet you are sure he acted alone.

Give me the link that states what you have put in the last sentence, because I have not seen that stated by LE in MSM.

 

[Tresir]

Trying to catch up with the last page or two, I'll never be able to go back and read all.

So who are you talking of here? RL again?

Imo they are covering Doolin's screw up and whether it was really a screw up as to RA disappearing right off from the possibilities for the next five plus years.

As to the RL psot I just replied to at length, I'd also add that I would assume LE asked the trail witnesses if Logan was who they saw that day. And I'm going to guess it was a no way for an answer. He also could not be the one seen on the road or it would be very unlikely. Just recalled that so adding it even though not on the right post. Lol.

I thought that post meant Sheriff Leazenby was mentioned 3 times by the tip line. If he means RL again then that would be his former wife and girlfriends, I bet. If he means RL, then BG is between 5'6" and 5'10 so that rules out RL.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Give me the link that states what you have put in the last sentence, because I have not seen that stated by LE in MSM.

Refresh me on where talk of fingerprints came from? I know hair and fibers were mentioned in his video he posted which was a narrative of something written by an Fed agent.

And yes, emu keeps stating things as facts that are not facts. We don't know if they know that prints and DNA belong to someone else but he states it does flat out. Not so. I'll take a link too thank you very much emu.

 

[Tresir]

Well, as you know, I don't have RL off my list. I've heard all of the reasons before as have you and find most of them not enough, particularly how he treated adult ex gfs/women and their opinions that BG was him. That seems uhm pretty natural. His anger is all I'd note from that and that's if all is true.

Did he kill two girls and then by 5 something p.m. was at the fish store? Why would you do that or who would ever do that after a murder like this? It doesn't provide him an alibi and was stupid.

They did do a probation violation based warrant to search his home for guns, etc. Did they attempt to match any gun to the casing or were they not legally allowed to? If they did, they would have come back with no success to proceed any further.

None of this largely circumstantial or hearsay stuff was enough for a full on warrant.

Of interest is that LE found fibers and hairs and I wonder if they've had any matches on those to Allen or family. They should be checking in the very same way they did in LISK.

The time he made a phone call that day is interesting but I don't see a 70 year old doing Snapchat. It COULD correlate with him calling someone to come in from the other side of the bridge, someone who was waiting, and force the girls down. However, he could have simply been calling a woman or someone to say he'd be in Lafeyette getting fish and did she want to have dinner for goodness sakes. It could be anything.

So he is in Lafeyette on 02/13 at 5:21 p.m. Google says that's 15 to 18 miles from Delphi. A bit odd isn't it that he'd leave and drive when LE was around searching for the girls and a lot of other peoplel...? Risky. That would lead me to believe he very well may have left right after that phone call and wasn't even around when the girls were murdered. And he'd be coming home for a fact in the dark. Was he even THERE that night? Or at what time? WHEN was the first in person contact by anyone with Logan?

While this is all interesting and contains many of the reasons I don't dismiss him, there is nothing much with any real weight. There is much that could fit together IF they had any real evidence of anything which they don't.

As far as BG and his height, that was a nothing burger, they spent little time on it other than saying his physical build was consistent, not his height specifically. I've either heard this one before or read the report by the agent. It isn't new to me most of the info although I may have forgotten the phone call and hair and fibers which I found most of note.

Here's the thing, let's say this was a few, not a big group but two or three and he called someone waiting on the trails and let's just say someone had told the girls to take a pic of Abby crossing the bridge (who was scared to it is said) and put it on Snapchat (like if the fake Shots asked her/them to) and Logan was the one to watch for it and then contact the other guy that it's time to corner them and force them down the hill, it is still not RL as BG on that bridge. Logan would have to cross it hoping no one was there somehow get around and behind them to then cross back over OR he would have had to go around to begin to come from behind them and in short order. I don't see that.

A couple of things First, LE likely knows who he called. I'd hope. And it probably related in no way to these murders. There was another important point/question I just blanked on so I guess I can't mention that one. If I recall, I'll come back and add it. Does Logan do things like Snapchat? I've never been near it and you and I are way younger than he'd be or have been. HIs live in gf in 2i016 would likely know. No mention of it. So would other users he may have engaged with know but again no mention of it.

Logan was scared of getting caught driving, do we really think he'd decide to risk his freedom and murder two girls? Seems pretty out there when you look at it that way. He would seem to fit only with a ring or another for some purpose like that. I guess he could have been angered two teens were crossing towards HIS land did it himself and just lost his temper but that's a huge stretch too.

Everything in this case as you know has been talked of, speculated and exhausted for years but IF the girls were alive until later than is thought, that changes a LOT of things. LE doesn't help those thoughts with the claim they were moved and staged. It leads me to believe there is much in this case unknown to the public yet, just as the new charges make me wonder...

Finally, it is really curious that defense wouldn't have went with something far more logical and a real suggestion like putting this on Logan. They can't connect RA to RL as far as we know so putting it on Logan with all of these points would be a lot more believable. I can only think they didn't because first LE DID investigate him and perhaps there is enough to show he didn't do it even though we don't know what that proof is OR RL does connect to RA in some way. Or it could have just been they simply needed and wanted something sensational and big like the Os plus they had to account for RA's confessions.

I don't really want to rehash the same old stuff again BUT I watched it which again was not new to me for the most part and did discuss it here, trying to hit on a few new things instead of all the same old that we already know.

I REALLY think there is more in this case that the defense was/is trying to keep from coming out or going further. I feel they NEEDED several big splashes, diversions, stall tactic, consuming the time and attention from the FM to the leak to then the ISC thing. They desperately NEED the warrant tossed and it's hard for me to believe it is just for the gun/bullet evidence THEY claim is nothingness. They NEED his confessions tossed, disbelieved, not heard.

Back to Logan, even though defense did not use that as a defense, LE I'd hope is ready to show in court that it couldn't have been him if necessary. I assume they are. The bullet alone makes it RA and not Logan though but I'd assume there is more. So, while I can be brought back to wondering if Logan fits in and I've never taken it off my possibilities, overall, I don't have it high on my list unless there's REALLY some BIG things we don't know and some evidence.

I said recently and even after watching this it's still true, all there really is are his lies and the fact that he can't help that it's his property right there. Everything else is hearsay and relate to adult unhealthy relationships and break ups and smoke. Nothing solid at all.

Was he EVEN HOME or left right around that same time?

If they did any checking before too late, I'd think they'd see his truck on camera somewhere. The same came that caught RA's car or one in Lafayette whether on the street, in a store, etc. OR a bar for that matter.

Anyhow I don't have time to keep up with all here much less all threads, so consider that my donation for the day or week or year on RL lol. Shouldn't have taken the time as it is. I have sooo much to do.

One of the searchers knocked on his door after 6 PM to ask about searching on his land the next day, I believe. This was all gone thru early in the search and during the investigation for the girls murders.

 

[GrandmaBear]

I thought that post meant Sheriff Leazenby was mentioned 3 times by the tip line. If he means RL again then that would be his former wife and girlfriends, I bet. If he means RL, then BG is between 5'6" and 5'10 so that rules out RL.

So he's talking of the sheriff?

As for RL, it said in his video how many tips were about RL and it was far more than that but that's to be expected. People who saw him on TV, found he lived there, heard about him from all over flood tip lines unfortunately. Here he is wearing a blue jacket and puts his hands in is pockets and armchair online detectives start calling in, etc. And I suppose a few in the area for the same reasons and others. I'm sure they had plenty of psychic calls as well lol.

I don't give it much weight. They have to clear tons of tips that have no meat but just opinion and speculation.

Do you think they asked the witnesses if who they saw was Logan? I'd think so and that they said no. I'd also think they asked if it could be Allen and shown some pictures. Did they get yeses?

There is so much we don't know yet. Tons.

 

[Tresir]

In part two at 24:00 Sherrif Leazanby says that fingerprints were collected, but they don't know if they belonged to the killer. Do those fingerprints match Allen's?

He then says they have DNA, but they don't know if it's the murderers. Does it match Allen's? If it did I'm sure they would have said so at a press conference. LISKS presser said it right off and said how they acquired his DNA.

I'd bet dollars to donuts that the DNA doesn't match Allen's.

This is Cuz's post saying Leazenby said they have fingerprints and DNA. But I believe the video he is quoting was 6 months before the arrest of RA.

Perhaps Cuz can clarify that.

I have said it before but I would imagine they could show perp pics to the witnesses and include a pic of RA in there to see if they pick him out.

 

[GrandmaBear]

One of the searchers knocked on his door after 6 PM to ask about searching on his land the next day, I believe. This was all gone thru early in the search and during the investigation for the girls murders.

Okay I couldn't recall. I almost thought I remembered the "landowner" not being at home at first so that's wrong then or maybe they tried at 4 or 5 and he wasn't. I take it you mean he did answer the door right?

And so he knew of the search and that they hadn't found them which I figured and I think shows his concern for an alibi.

So how long was he in Lafayette... We know of the fish store and time. I kind of doubt he took a risk and went in just for one purpose. It wouldn't be hard for me to believe he went in for booze and groceries and other things too. Delphi is the only city and the county seat of Carroll County and I can see him going out of county to drive and get other things and try to avoid local police and deputies who would know of his nondriving status, etc.

 

[GrandmaBear]

This is Cuz's post saying Leazenby said they have fingerprints and DNA. But I believe the video he is quoting was 6 months before the arrest of RA.

Perhaps Cuz can clarify that.

I have said it before but I would imagine they could show perp pics to the witnesses and include a pic of RA in there to see if they pick him out.

Oh yeah that's right he's watching that thing Olenna posted. Two parts. I didn't watch that. Not enough time. In fact I need to get moving. I've sat her like a lazy deadbeat all day and I can't and have so much that HAS to be done. No oomph though.

 

[Tresir]

Another thing from the video: 23:53

When the video was made in May 2022, they had no witness' saying they saw someone coming from the crime scene covered in blood and soaking wet. So where did this magic witness that saw a muddy and bloody guy come from?

That witness is in the PCA.

 

[Tresir]

Okay I couldn't recall. I almost thought I remembered the "landowner" not being at home at first so that's wrong then or maybe they tried at 4 or 5 and he wasn't. I take it you mean he did answer the door right?

And so he knew of the search and that they hadn't found them which I figured and I think shows his concern for an alibi.

So how long was he in Lafayette... We know of the fish store and time. I kind of doubt he took a risk and went in just for one purpose. It wouldn't be hard for me to believe he went in for booze and groceries and other things too. Delphi is the only city and the county seat of Carroll County and I can see him going out of county to drive and get other things and try to avoid local police and deputies who would know of his nondriving status, etc.

Yes IIRC they couldn't get him earlier. They knocked on all the doors in the vicinity of the bridge and were looking in gardens and outhouses IIRC. With RL it was well after dark when they finally got him at home.

 

[GrandmaBear]

That witness is in the PCA.

That witness isn't new, she's been known of since the early years hasn't she? There was always a man seen walking on the road as I recall.

I didn't even react or respond to that post of his. As to all witnesses, none have gone public to my knowledge and we will get to see them and hear from them at trial. I don't see much point in debating them, at least I'm not going to. They are eyewitnesses and see and recall what they do and with something that may seem unimportant at the time. They supplement more often than they are the sole reason for conviction.

I will say I recall thinking or hearing she saw someone that looked like he'd been in a fight and that to me is muddy and bloody and she may have said that too, I don't recall. It's certainly what we've always heard or had the impression of for years on end.

I also didn't comment on emu's car thing. I don't see the point for the same reasons. We will get to hear all at trial and judge for ourselves but I think they all saw what they saw, are all truthful, to the best of what they recollect. They were there and came forward in hopes of helping the right perp/s to be caught for terrible murders of young girls. I see NO motive nor anything else nor reason to think so.

Guys sure are more often car guys. I can only speak for myself and friends but I know the ones I know and that's it. I can even go back to high school and think of the ones I knew or learned then. The ones that interested me, I learned and knew. Like some classic restored Nova for instance. That was one. All these years later, I know for current models or in the last decade or two or three the ones I've driven, the ones I've wanted, the ones my folks have had over the years. I can't tell you even though I've seen them plenty what my three sisters or their hubs drive or their kids. I care less today honestly and it's the last thing on my mind. If I'm walking through a parking lot and some really nice car catches my fancy or attention or just an attractively lined modern day car, I might see if I can glance or see what it is but that's about it. I would be in a big spot having to ID a vehicle I saw when I had no reason t think I'd need to know or remember. I know some emblems or logos and far from all. I can see a model name and not know the manufacturer and NO ONE was next to the vehicle.

It is all to come together as it does and did. It is not the ONLY thing, it is a piece of the puzzle. We also have RA saying where he parked.

Anyhow that's my take on these things. I largely skip such posts because it just isn't going to go anywhere which most of what we have to discuss doesn't when we rehash some of it hoping I guess we get some new thought, find some nugget, have a new revelation. while we wait for more.

If there is one case of any followed by any ardent follower that has been rehashed and everything heard over and over through the years, it is this one. It used to be comparing every new person that got arrested for something else and came to our attention and more. Now with an arrest most of us have opinions we've settled mostly on where it used to be most not knowing who or what or why and all possibilities were open for most. I always thought it close to home but let myself entertain the possibility it wasn't but always felt that at heart. I considered EVERYTHING over the years as i think most did. The taking apart of what he was wearing or carrying was done to death too (BG).

Anyhow.... We all have our opinions now or where we've mostly settled but still with many questions and at least for me, I'm still open to new info and settling 100 percent which I try never to do. I think lol most of us self included are stuck on where the facts and what we know have brought us to as most likely and we don't change the opinions of each other either and can't. I'm pretty settled on two basic possibilities although details could vary certainly on those possibilities. Emu is the only one all over the place lol. Yet suck on some things at the same time.

Good Lord I have to get off my rear or I'm going to be in a real fix if I don't get some very necessary things done.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Yes IIRC they couldn't get him earlier. They knocked on all the doors in the vicinity of the bridge and were looking in gardens and outhouses IIRC. With RL it was well after dark when they finally got him at home.

Yes, that's what I was thinking or thought I remembered. I thought they attempted and he wasn't home at first. And I thought at some point he was but for the life of me couldn't remember when or if they found him home that night but was sure they had, thought I recalled that, but just couldn't recall when or the details.

It's all unfortunate where he's concerned. Because of his lies mostly I can remain about 50/50 on him, the main thing that has me excluding him is he doesn't fit in any way with RA and there never was any solid evidence. The fact he owns the land was likely a very unfortunate thing for him, nothing he did. I truly don't today think he was involved but if there was a plan to take these girls elsewhere or a group, or anything solid, I'd take another look at it.

I truly think RA was on his own and the only thing I haven't mostly dismissed as I have with RL (mostly, not 100 percent but mostly out of an pic for me) is the KK thing. Aside from all the stuff going on with KK relating to this or tied in ways and RA's arrest not long after is one thing but I don't believe in big coincidences and not one like where KK was to meet Libby at this VERY PLACE and RA actually did like a day later. Wasn't it just a day apart or some such? And the girls had been trying to go to the bridge before I know that. Kelsey felt bad so caved that day and agreed to take them. Something on that order. Your memory is better than mine and I have little time to refresh mine these days on any case. I have to rely on others. Sorry.

Anyhow, that coincidence I can't let go of. I don't think it means KK was necessarily there or involved but somehow the had the same kind of info, place, meeting in the same time frame and likely through the fake profile, the dropbox, the same SM site or through some dark site and whether one knew the other or not, not sure but some online thing, I just don't know...

That little piece is just TOO MUCH FOR ME TO IGNORE. It doesn't mean though that RA still didn't do it on his own and as you've said came by the info from KK or through some group using the Shots thing or dropbox.... And if so, RA is a pedo. How often he has acted on it is another question but he has an interest in minor children. Girls probably specifically as KK was.

That then is a large part, not all, why I still think the motive was sexual at least in part. It may have went wrong or there is more we don't know yet but I still think it was motive or the biggest part of it. i know you don't but if he ties to KK or was part of the same things, then well, they're pedos.

I guess I'm down to what can't be dismissed and the KK Libby meeting can't be at the same place etc. RL and Os and all others I don't have any trouble putting out to the sidelines. Os I have no problem ruling out altogether.

I rest mainly on RA alone. There is ABSOLUTELY no indication there was anyone else.

 

[Tresir]

Ok regarding KK/A.Shots and RA, if they are in a paedo ring then KK could have passed the contact on to RA ot his father could have done that. KK said he took the blame for some of the charges that were his father but I don't think LE believed him.

There is something there because I believe RA and KKs father worked at Chrysler together in the past. I am also wondering if KK and RA/KA's daughter are similar ages and knew each other.

I am not sure of this so JMO on this

ETA they are similar ages. Both were 28 at the time of RA's arrest. Two articles below quote their ages.

Kegan Kline, child porn suspect linked to Delphi murders investigation, in court Thursday

PERU, Ind. (WISH) — Kegan Kline, a central figure in the Delphi murders investigation, will appear in a Miami County courtroom Thursday morning for a pretrial hearing in his child pornography case. Kline, 28, of Kokomo, has been linked to the investigation into the 2017 murders of Abigail “Abby”...

www.wishtv.com

Daughter of arrested Delphi Bridge suspect in SAME spot girls vanished

A chilling photo shows the daughter Richard Allen, 50, posing on the train bridge where Libby German, 14, and Abigail Williams, 13, disappeared in 2017.

www.dailymail.co.uk

So they lived in the same street and children were the same age. What a coincidinky.

 

[GrandmaBear]

Ok regarding KK/A.Shots and RA, if they are in a paedo ring then KK could have passed the contact on to RA ot his father could have done that. KK said he took the blame for some of the charges that were his father but I don't think LE believed him.

There is something there because I believe RA and KKs father worked at Chrysler together in the past. I am also wondering if KK and RA/KA's daughter are similar ages and knew each other.

I am not sure of this so JMO on this

ETA they are similar ages. Both were 28 at the time of RA's arrest. Two articles below quote their ages.

Kegan Kline, child porn suspect linked to Delphi murders investigation, in court Thursday

PERU, Ind. (WISH) — Kegan Kline, a central figure in the Delphi murders investigation, will appear in a Miami County courtroom Thursday morning for a pretrial hearing in his child pornography case. Kline, 28, of Kokomo, has been linked to the investigation into the 2017 murders of Abigail “Abby”...

www.wishtv.com

Daughter of arrested Delphi Bridge suspect in SAME spot girls vanished

A chilling photo shows the daughter Richard Allen, 50, posing on the train bridge where Libby German, 14, and Abigail Williams, 13, disappeared in 2017.

www.dailymail.co.uk

So they lived in the same street and children were the same age. What a coincidinky.

Yep and I don't believe in too many coinkydinks and it is too many. Same street, worked same place, kids same age, both men connected to same dead girl/s at same place in same town. And on and on. All these things are why I can't dismiss a KK and RA connection of SOME time and think there almost has to be one.

For me, it's where things lead and are logical. Either scenario I feel I have settled on is not out there with nothing indicating such. RA imo is definitely guilty. And if someone else plays in in any way at all it connects to Kline and the online thing, etc. And likely the pedo thing.

I think too that KK's dad got away with sh*t and KK covered for it.

You mean RA and the father of Kline worked together right? You don't mean Allen's father and Kline's father worked together? It's clear but just want to be certain.

There were questions and talk with Kline and perhaps from him of some friend that night if I recall. Going back to his interviews might be interesting now but I sure don't have time for that. If only because when they questioned KK we knew they were wondering who else accessed the dropbox etc. and all sorts of hinted questions but we had NO IDEA at that time of RA or anything about him. Not that he ever gave any big information that would be worth it I guess.

Anyhow, yeah, I don't know how anyone can dismiss SOME connection here with KK and RA and RA ending up with THESE girls at the very place Kline was to meet Libby. Way too coincidental, beyond actually.

 

[Sunburst]

It is quite obvious. It's terrifying that girls this age are so naive as to believe someone like that could really be seriously interested in them. And these types know it and take advantage of that.

They're teens, what DO you do about it. You can teach them, warn them, take their phones at night when they head for their room and they could still have a burner or end up enamored with some hot guy or who they believe to be. You could set up your wifi and internet to be safe and they could still buy mobile time, etc.

It's terrifying. Imo. More needs to be done.

A few years ago, one of my coworkers had a huge problem convincing her teen daughter that (world famous rap star) would not be communicating online with a 13 year old In a semi-rural town. It took months before daughter realized mom was right.

 

[GrandmaBear]

A few years ago, one of my coworkers had a huge problem convincing her teen daughter that (world famous rap star) would not be communicating online with a 13 year old In a semi-rural town. It took months before daughter realized mom was right.

OMG. At least her mom knew about it or she told mom? I don't even blame parents for this in cases where they should maybe have monitored more. They can be told, taught, monitored, etc. and still they can get on devices elsewhere, hide one, and just are at such a vulnerable naive point in life. It really isn't different in some ways than any generation, always dangers and naivete whether to drugs, men in vans, strangers with candy (and all those things don't cover the one that drives something else etc.) but the venue has changed and quick accessibility to a child has multiplied tenfold with the online thing.

Look at this case. Abby had some real rules. Libby's grandma, Kelsey and dad only let them go to the trail for like 45 minutes and together. They weren't five. They had a phone. Parents never know all and none of us or ours were any different unless anyone here would claim to be an angel who never pulled anything on their parents, even minor as a teen, etc. or made a mistake. Us older ones know better but each generation has something new parents aren't up on either.

All the cold cases and missing people unidentified like from the 60s and 70s stand out to me with free love, hitchhiking and drugs, etc. It stands out to me because it wasn't my era but I saw and watched it with my parents, other parents and their kids that were that age like my siblings. HITCHHIKING. Would a one do it today? But even then tons did not end up safe...

I don't think it is that things have changed and children are more naive or pulling more or anything, it's the access to kids.

I don't like regulation and I don't want internet charged or taxed like as to access any page, etc. but the dark web and other things definitely should be and just the defaults in children's apps etc. that parents don't even know come with new games or apps is so wrong.

I don't know. I thank God when my kids were teens we were on the edge of it and it was somewhat archaic when I got it before they were 18 but were teens, it was slow, it was dial up, I sure did not know much about it but I found my youngest one night up at 4 a.m. on it and let me tell you I could not even get to a site that wouldn't do the circles or load or hang but she was trying. I didn't know sh*t about it at that point and neither did they imo. But the kids always know more.

It turned out to be shopping thank goodness and using someone's card. Still NOT a good thing but I would have had no clue you even could do that.

Parents are older and wiser and live and learn but no generation is up on what is being shown to kids, who contacts kids or what the newest app is or tricks.

It sounds like your coworker's thing turned out right? And all is fine?

Just from following other cases and news through the years, I always felt this case had an online thing way back when they denied it basically over years. The Snapchat photo and their age was honestly enough to lean that way for me. As the early days went Libby's phone being wiped not having the family finder or whatever on it, and then her recording BG, CLEARLY the girls or Libby were on apps and used tech of course. Not just probably in school but at home. They were the age they were and the two together had been up most of the night together in Libby's room the night before. It just seemed obvious to me they likely weren't playing dolls or making crafts. From early on.

BUT LE kept shutting the online thing and activity down over years. Soi I doubted but I still thought it likely. Always.

That's not a judgment of either the girls or the parents. This could happen to ANYONE I don't care how on top of things you stay. Any parent knows that even if they went through thankfully little trouble of any kind. Any CHILD or ANY parent could end up because of predators and the age in any generation, now more than ever, in such a boat. Short of chaining your child 24/7 to your wrist.

It is just terrifying.

I'd be curious to know more about the coworker. Again she either monitored or daughter told her? Did she make a point of showing her over time and asking the "fake persona" questions, etc.? I'd maybe get on there as a parent and pretend to be the child to show it and catch them.

Anyhow I'm rambling but what do you think here? Do you think RA somehow connects to KK or somehow something online had RA at that site knowing the girls would be there?

I think if they know a connection to online or likelihood with RA knowing it at some point here would be good. It would be a case to point out to parents AND for them to show children of the dangers. These girls had good parents from all appearances. Of course in Libby's case it is grandparents but still dad was picking her up and he was THERE. The alarm was raised fast. No hesitation. I'm not even sure I would have if I knew my kid or thought they likely weren't into anything in a rural setting in a small town area where you all grew up. I would have alerted family etc. just to find them on the trails or in the woods just because dark would fall before long but for all they knew they were in town or at a friends and pulling something which was of course hoped for and thought of. It seems dad immediately called grandma, etc.

They weren't there or allowed to be for hours that day, just a limited time with rides on both ends of not even an HOUR. You also can't be so restrictive with a teen that they rebel or act as if they aren't old enough to do anything but they did everything right here imo. And they were together and not alone. With a phone.

It just BITES.

And again I am rambling. I just think it is part of why this case gets to so many. This wasn't in Indy. Or Pittsburgh. Delphi is the only city in Carroll County at less than 6,000 people. I actually looked that up today. I knew it was small but did not know it was the only "city". They weren't grade school and they were old enough to do something on their own together once in awhile with rules and that's all i was.

Only the parents did not know there was perhaps a meeting or something else planned which could happen to ANY parent. And any that deny that don't know sh*t imo.

And to end this rambling long post, for me that makes RA a total monster. I don't feel the sympathy for him some do. I do believe in rights but I am not going to jump to any conclusion those are being violated when it comes from defense or him. Someone that can do this is evil and not pitiful. And from all I can see he did this.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

RA admitted being on the trails 1.30 to 3.30 even before the pic of BG was released. He told DD he saw 3 girls at Freedom bridge. He told him he went to the bridge to watch fish. He did not admit to seeing the girls at all yet he would have been there at the same time as them.

Why did the witnesses see no others on the trail that day?

What you are saying is not correct and I see nothing to show that more than just one guy BG/RA was on the trail and bridge and the witnesses have always claimed the exact same thing. One guy, alone.

He had to tell them he was at the trails, because he was seen when he first arrived, and he knew that he had been seen.

There was no other adult male on the trail in that two hour period.

The witness that saw him leaving was going by in a vehicle when they saw him.

So if the police framed him, why did they take so long to do it?

Don't forgot, RA does not have a criminal record AFAIK, so neither his fingerprints or DNA would be in the system IMO.

You seem to think that the perp would walk around without any attempt to hide himself. That doesn't seem logical to me. If BG is Ron Logan he could easily get to the bridge without anybody seeing him. One of the reasons they got a search warrant is because RL had been identified as BG. Suddenly it isn't the 5'11" man anymore. It's the 5'4" man. This doesn't bother you?

RL ALWAYS carried a gun. That's from those who knew him well.

He drove himself to the dump and to Lafayette and had a receipt from the store. He didn't want the police to know he drove so he got a friend to lie about the driving. I followed his case at the time.

He wasn't driving to the store at the times he claims. He told his cousin to tell cops that he came back between five and five thirty. The receipt is timed at 5:21. He had a lot of free time before he went to the fish store.

He'd never asked his cousin to lie for him before. He didn't ask him to lie about his trip earlier in the day. He wanted an alibi for a specific time frame, that just happened to be when Libby and Abby went missing.

One theory I have is that the girls weren't killed until much later in the day. That might explain the 10pm phone call from the vicinity of the bodies. Maybe "It's done." The FBI agent has some powerful thoughts on it being a group of people involved. I'm 99.99999999% sure more than one was involved, and that RL was one of them.

Also, in the video where Leazenby is interviewed, he sounds like BG too. Similar sounding voices aren't hard to come by. Fortunately, me, my brother and my father are the only three in my family cursed with my strange vocal tones.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

I don't trust that part of your video at all as to where he was on his property. Much has been said about the lack of towers, etc. in Delphi and in that area. He was present at home yes, at the scene the girls were found dead at I don't buy for a minute. And at 10 if he was he could have well been looking for them and weren't some searchers out all night or some such?

Anyhow I found that part of your video and the points the weakest of all I noted that instantly. People make phone calls and by now I'm sure he probably knew there were girls missing. Everyone was probably making calls and it happened near him. He could have even been returning a call. I imagine LE knows who he called. Even if he did kill them which he didn't, what does a ten p.m. phone call mean? Nothing. They are attempting to say he was near or at the place the girls were found dead and it's really weak. They were found only 1400 feet from his house. If he was home or pulling in, etc. anywhere there he'd be near them. He LIVED there.

RA was at the trails and did not have the misfortune of living there. RA was on the right side of the bridge, Logan was not. You doubt they have the right guy in RA and don't think they have a strong case but you have RL guilty with basically NO case or physical evidence of any kind.

You know I haven't dismissed him but a lot of what you quote isn't solid nor means anything solid AND in fact some doesn't fit together at all. Especially with you having RL as BG.

As for the agent's thing, they are trying to come up with enough for a warrant and to build a case and that's the best they had which wasn't much that was solid. It's interesting, it can make sense and add up but there isn't a bit of meat in it except the lies and fake alibi. And that's not enough.

The video was made by an FBI agent. I think they know more than you or I about phone pings.

 

[Cousin Dupree]

We know he was in Lafayette at 5:21. I don't know that they can place him there at the time of the murders/girls' disappearance. The alibi was a lie as to someone driving him there and whether we will ever know what time he drove himself to Lafeyette and left home, I'm not sure. I'd think they would have looked into it but how quickly...?

So I don't think we know or am I forgetting something that tell us?

If it was a lie to cover the fact he was driving, then why give the wrong times?

 

[Cousin Dupree]

Give me the link that states what you have put in the last sentence, because I have not seen that stated by LE in MSM.

Leazenby says in a video soon after the deaths that they have DNA and fingerprints. They have not, so far, said they match RA. The interview is in he video @Olenna posted.